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22 January 2021

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Ed Lindgren

Christopher Manion, in the January 14th issue of The Wanderer, states (in jest) that the USCCB is standing up a new committee. It will be the Bishop’s Committee on the Perpetual Pondering of Catholic Joe’s Complex Catholicism.

It was bad enough when virtually all the Bishops in the US hung out the white flag and closed the vast majority of parishes in America without a fight (denying Catholics access to the Sacraments).

Now for however long ol’ Joe is President (one month?...three months?...who knows?), we will watch the Bishops tie themselves in knots trying to square Joe’s politics with his ‘devout’ Catholic faith.

longarch

The subordinate said: I will just take the opportunity to remind all of you that he is a devout Catholic and somebody who attends church regularly.

The first point is that the subordinate is saying it about Biden, so Biden cannot be personally held responsible for the claim.

The second point is that "regularly" is suspiciously vague. If the subordinate had said, "Biden attends Mass at least once a week and also on every Holy Day of Obligation" then that would sound like standard Catholic observance. But it would also probably be verifiably wrong.

The third point is that "regularly" can describe any interval of time. A person who goes to Mass once every ten years is going "regularly" but is not meeting the requirements of Catholicism.

Bruins Fan

His support of, or cooperation with, abortion is formal (indirectly) not material (directly) but given his role as President it seems pretty close to material if not more. But a devout Catholic would avoid going along with either material or formal cooperation. Same thing with gay marriage, etc.

I think when you reach middle age, certainly Biden’s age, it wouldn’t hurt to develop a bit of scrupulousity. But I don’t think it’s possible in national Democrat party politics today where you have a choice of either a political career or your Catholic faith. And I don’t really think being a pro-life Democrat is an option as abortion-on-demand is part of the party platform.

I think for mature Catholics like Joe Biden, a good plan of action would be to develop a bit of scrupulousity, partake of the Sacrament of Reconciliation regularly*, and daily think of ways to do works of mercy and St. Thérèse of Lisieux’s ‘Little Way’.

*Fulton Sheen has a somewhat humorous, albeit serious, example of what staying away from the Sacrament of Reconciliation can lead to.

From Your Life is Worth Living by Fulton Sheen (New York: Image, 2019), pp. 272-273:

Suppose we have someone who has not been to confession in fifty years. Suppose he's eighty years old. What kind of a confession can he make? He cannot remember all of the number of sins and the like. His confession might be something like this:


Father, it has been fifty years since I last went to confession. During twenty years of my life I never went to Mass. I never frequented the sacraments. I never made my Easter duty. I did not fast. Many times a day I took the name of God falsely, I used it falsely. I also took false oaths in court about five times. I was disobedient in a very serious way to civil authorities, twice. I assisted an abortion, twice. I murdered, once. I was an alcoholic for ten years. I had immodest thoughts, certainly everyday for about thirty years, immodest actions with myself many times for about ten years. While living with my first wife I was guilty of adultery many times over a period of three years. While my first wife was living I married again, so I lived in adultery for about five years. Now she is dead. During this time, in business, I cut corners; I underpaid my employees; I thought only about making money. I never gave to any charities, except when I was forced to out of public shame. I particularly regret, once, refusing to send one hundred dollars to the Holy Father for missions of the world when I had plenty of money. I gave myself over to an excessive spirit of amusement and parties. I can never recall once in my life ever having helped someone in distress. I never gave up my evenings once to help the Church. I completely neglected my wife as regards esteem and affection. I never sent my children to a religious school. I left them to do as they pleased and I became angry with them for their impiety and now I am suffering. For these and all sins of my past life, those which I do not remember, but as God sees them, I ask pardon of God and you, Father.

This is a confession of a man away from the sacrament fifty years.

But after the priest administers absolution Christ wipes these sins away. They are no more. They are forgiven and forgotten. (“Though your sins be like scarlet, they become white as snow; though they may be red as crimson they become white as wool.” Isaiah 1:18). Go in peace. So amazing.

Pray for Joe Biden.

turcopolier

Bruins fan

You sound like a priest. That sounds like a lot of sophistic nonsense to me.

BillWade

American women's sport now dead. Chicks with dicks will rule!

Better fill up the tank today, gonna be more tomorrow.

Fred

When is the last time the church excommunicated a politician, or is that not appropriate?

turcopolier

BillWade

Or, chicks who formerly had dicks ...

jerseycityjoan

Here's my two cents as an outsider:

As best I can tell, the vast majority of American Catholics do not follow Church teachings on at least one of these four things: getting married when living together, artificial birth control, abortion and capital punishment. I am including in this group men who don't use artificial birth control but their wives or partners do and people who used it when they were younger but stopped when the female in the relationship reached menopause.

Nevertheless many of these people consider themselves devout Catholics like Joe Biden does. They prefer hypocrisy to leaving the Catholic Church out of love. The pull of the church is strong; they do not want to leave it.

The Catholic Church is already having two crises: a lack of people with vocations who are willing to be celibate and having enough money to keep programs and buildings going.

I don't see how the Church in America as Catholics know it can survive with a purge of the magnitude you suggest. Is this something that the Church is willing to live with?

Eliot

With the death of the Episcopal Church, I’ve been considering conversion. But it appears that the rot you see in the Episcopal Church has also spread to the Catholic Church, is that fair?

I’ve looked at Orthodoxy, but the Orthodox churches tend to be very ethnic and very local, perhaps in the way Islam is.

- Eliot

Horace

@Eliot

I've been through a similar process. The poz saturates our society.


The Orthodox are not unpozzed, but less pozzed. That they are in better shape than the rest of Christendom is not uncorrelated with their ethnic natures. I suggest that the non-universalist cultural component (deep culture) helps buttress their institutional sociological immune system, specifically by making it easier to keep the wolves out of positions of hiring, teaching, or leadership.

Deap

The science is settled in California - religious institutions were not allowed to hold indoor services in this state.

So put on your woolies, Joe and Jill 'cause you are taking communion now in real snowflakes out doors, not just appointing them to your cabinet.

I think is called "religious equity" or something. Or bringing California Blue to the rest of you. Amen.

Bruins fan

@turcopolier

Nope, not a priest. Far from it professionally, though I do have degrees in philosophy and Thomistic theology.

‘sounds like a lot of sophistic nonsense’—> ‘sound like a priest’

I know Sister Mary Margaret didn’t teach you this.

Bruins fan

@longarch

To be a member of the Roman Catholic the minimal requirements (Precepts of the Church, Catechism of the Catholic Church, 2041) are:

1) Attend Sunday Mass and Mass on Holy Days of Obligation 2) Confess your sins once a year 3) You must receive the Eucharist during Easter season 4) Observe days of fasting and abstinence 5) Help provide for material needs of the Church, each according to your ability (i.e., financial, etc.)
longarch

Jersey City Joan wrote:

The Catholic Church is already having two crises: a lack of people with vocations who are willing to be celibate and having enough money to keep programs and buildings going.

I think the Catholic Church worldwide has many crises. I am not sure which are the most important, but there are probably more than a dozen serious crises.

Ed Lindgren wrote:

It was bad enough when virtually all the Bishops in the US hung out the white flag and closed the vast majority of parishes in America without a fight (denying Catholics access to the Sacraments).

Years ago, I would have argued that access to sacraments was vital for Catholics. The Catholic Church used to give me the impression that it still believed in miracles, and that the various Sacraments were in some way miraculous. At the very least, they were "miracles" because they were "outward and visible signs of inward and invisible grace."

As far as I can tell, the Catholic Church led by Pope Francis appears to be entirely devoid of miracles and spiritual events. It appears to be a secular organization that promotes political correctness and adherence to fashions such as COVID panic. I note that some bishops are attempting to resist Francis and some of them have probably been excommunicated already.

I note that many lapsed Catholics are attracted to New Age mysticism and New Thought "gospel of success" ideas. These lapsed Catholics appear to desire a sense that miracles are real and can be manifested by sincere aspiration. They are very different than the old Catholics of the sort that listened respectfully to Fulton Sheen. I thank Bruins Fan for reminding me of Fulton Sheen -- of whom I have not heard in many years.

Some Protestants of my acquaintance predict that Pope Francis will be revealed to have used Church resources for the commission of crimes including human trafficking. They predict that Catholicism will be over when that happens. I do not endorse their prediction, but it seems to express a reasonable skepticism regarding the papacy.

optimax

The last pro-life Democrat in the House Daniel Lipinski lost his primary. Looks like there were problems with the vote in Chicago last primary.

https://www.washingtontimes.com/news/2020/mar/25/last-pro-life-democrat-dan-lipinski-loses-to-marie/

Seward

Very minor point, but there has never been an institution named "The Roman Catholic Church." It has always been simply "The Catholic Church," a name dating back to Bishop Ignatius of Antioch's "Letter to the Smyrneans," conventionally dated about 107 AD, when it seems to already be infuse as a title. (St.) Ignatius was being transported to Rome in chains to be thrown to the lions (literally). The term "Roman Catholic" dates from 1581 AD, in a pamphlet by Prercival Wellburn, a Puritan clergyman, to distinguish the Catholic Church from the newly formed Church of England. (He didn't like either.) The terms is used almost exclusively in English-speaking countries. (I've had American Episcopalians of my acquaintance refer to me occasionally as a "Roman" or sometimes a "Romanist" -- usually in a dismissive fashion.)

You can look it up in the 1913 Catholic Encyclopedia, or on Wikipedia.

BillWade

Now that USA men can compete in USA women's sport I feel a need to press for them also to be able to compete in the Special Olympics as well.

Diana Croissant

I am pro-life, following the Sixth Commandment which says simply: "Thou shalt not kill."

I do not need a Priest to tell me that abortion is wrong.

That does not mean that I don't know many Protestants who find ways to skirt the exact words of that commandment. And the arguments for and against birth control were pretty contentious at the time that birth control became widely available. The Rhythm method versus birth control pharmaceuticals was a hotly contested issue in my early college years.

I personally am still wavering on the issue, though I am clearly NOT divided about the issue of abortion. These are both issues that I hope will finally be resolved for me when I finally die and can ask the Divine to give me an answer.

I had a very Psychic mother. She had survived two near-death experiences. She once told me that she knew my younger sibling had undergone an abortion because her "grandchild" had been crying out to her before the procedure. Later, I did confirm that my sibling had undergone an abortion at the time my mother had made that claim.

That chain of events solidified my absolute belief that abortion is wrong. It's one of those choices that might fit into the saying: "If you don't want to do the time, don't do the crime." But it is also really the Sixth Commandment. That comes from God.

English Outsider


Reminds me a little of the celebrations when the Man with the Golden Voice started his Presidency in 2009. This is hagiography, not political comment -

https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/jan/23/inauguration-joe-biden-kamala-lady-gaga-bernie-trump

It feels overdone, more artificial, this time round. And the venom directed against Trump here and elsewhere is shocking. They want him bankrupt, divorced and if possible in prison. Preferably as many of his associates as possible too.

But the welcome accorded to a new President by his supporters should derive from more than just relief that the previous one has gone.

jerseycityjoan

Bill Wade,

I am sure there are people trying to get trans women into the Special Olympics. What a world.

Artemesia

With respect, Diana Croissant, The Church Militant's over-investment in pro-life activism has effectively neutered it. It is a ruse hyperbolized upon the Church by its enemies, and the enemies win EVERY.STINKING.TIME.

The last time I am aware of that the Church took a strong voice, from the very top, against USA war mongering -- and violation of the Sixth Commandment, Thou Shalt Not Kill -- was when Pio Laghi, then about 80 years old, traveled from Rome to Washington in March, 2003 to urge George W. Bush NOT to go to war against Iraq. His efforts were unsuccessful.

Where are the Catholic voices speaking out without ceasing against the killing of hundreds of thousands of persons in foreign nations? Are they not children of god entitled to life?

As long as zionists can keep Catholics fighting amongst themselves and with (what are in my view) rather pathetic "March to Life" and "Vote Pro Life" political action, the Adversary is free to roam around the world seeking whom to destroy. And so they have done, until now, USA is on the chopping block.

Do Pro Life activists even recognize the evil that is being done in their name, while their voices are sidelined?

Operation Mincemeat was an elaborate scheme to persuade Hitler that the Allies would invade S Europe from Sardinia, rather than Sicily. Those who celebrate Operation Mincemeat, and especially those with a stake in success of the movie, boast that the scheme was successful, but there is no indication that Germans "swarmed" to Sardinia and Greece.
But it does appear that the zionists have made mincemeat of the anti-war moral force of the Roman Catholic Church.

To salt the wounds: zionists and neocons have their operatives firmly planted in the Vatican: Juan Zarate was a charter member of Stuart Levey's "guerrillas in grey suits," the team Level assembled in the US Treasury Dept Office of Terror Finance/ Foreign Assets Control to wage economic war on "terrorist" states by pressuring any international bank or business that might do business with them. Iran was Target #1.

After his stint with OFAC and various AIPAC-associated organizations, Pope Francis appointed Zarate to the Vatican Financial Intelligence Authority (FIA): the fox comfortably ensconced in the henhouse. https://www.bbc.com/news/business-27727304
It seems Foxy Juan was distracted: in 2019 the Vatican was once again embroiled in a massive financial scandal. Francis replaced the head of FIA with an Italian banker, fired others of the board; Zarate resigned, complaining that "the reforms FIA had made had not been given a chance ---." https://abcnews.go.com/Business/wireStory/pope-taps-bank-italy-exec-head-watchdog-agency-67342284

Zarate is now with Foundation for Defense of Democracy (FDD), the virulently anti-Iran zionist org. with close ties to all the other virulently zionist organizations who are now seeing themselves re-assigned to key positions in the Beijing Biden administration.

Zarate is not the only fox in the Catholic henhouse. Callista Gingrich, Catholic wife of convert to Catholicism Newt, recently hosted Elan Carr, now US State Department Ambassador to Monitor AntiSemitism (in one of his last acts, Trump elevated Carr's post from Special Envoy to Ambassador).
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=3op7FIIM60c
Carr has decreed that "anti-zionism is anti-semitism". He said that the Catholic Church and the Vatican have an important role to play in "combatting the decade-long rise in antisemitism."

It's not likely that the Vatican will oppose Israel's routine killing of Palestinians as long as people like Juan Zarate have their finger on the pulse of Vatican finances, and when Elan Carr, representing a multitude of Jewish organizations, can pressure the US Ambassador to the Vatican.

Cortes

Bill Wade, you probably remember the morally bankrupt Spanish basketball team which lifted gold in Sydney 2000 - only 2 of the squad of 12 had the qualifying mental impairment. The old expression “couldn’t mark their neck with a blowtorch” seems appropriate. Further details and photos at

https://www.dailymail.co.uk/sport/othersports/article-2459172/Spanish-basketball-team-pretended-disabled-win-Paralympic-gold-guilty-fraud.html

Diana Croissant

Artemisia,

I am sorry that I did respond earlier. I have been very distracted lately over personal/family problems.

I understand clearly your argument concerning the military. It could be carried further back into history, if you think about it, even to the Crusades.

I am a female of the Vietnam Era. Many of my high school friends, my cousins, and my brothers had to either join a branch of the service or wait to see if they would be drafted. I spent much thought and prayer on the question of killing in war. I worried about the toll it might take on the souls of our soldiers.

The Sixth Commandment can be easily addressed when one thinks only about a person's individual life--not his/her life during the Draft or voluntary military service. I recently re-watched Saving Private Ryan. I could not make myself re-watch Platoon.

I have often had to view the Ten Commandments as simple rules for living one's personal life. The admonition in the Sixth Commandment certainly means not to make a personal decision to kill/murder another person, which I believe a fetus is indeed. And I have much reason for believing that. I believe I mentioned some of those reasons earlier.

turcopolier

Diana Croissant

Oh, boohoo. If only God will forgive me for fighting the god damned Communists.

Joe90

Given that joe dose not care how you vote, why do you believe he cares what you think ?

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