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04 October 2020

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walrus

“ Estonia lies at the frontline of efforts to contain Russian revanchism. Once occupied by the Soviet Union, the country has no intention of losing its independence again and has eagerly joined Western economic and defense alliances. ”

This is another piece of crap article from the liars and propagandists at The Atlantic. It’s not worth reading

Babak makkinejad

Walrus

Russians can use the manufactured excuse of attacks against the Russian populations in Estonia, Lithuania, and Latvia to intrevene within an hour, with their polite Green men, to protect their brethren. They could do a Ecvit-in-Cyprus before NATO could react either politically or militarily.

NATO will do what when 40% or more of Riga, Talin, and Vilnius is controlled by the Russian Self-Protection Units, themselves modeled after the Kurdish YPG? Units that the Russian Federation, will deny any link or association with?

Serge

Here is the article, for those like me getting paywalled:
https://archive.is/qt9YA

fakebot

The Russians are not alone in using honey traps. Take for example Julian Assange. He's now facing extradition to the US because a mystery woman claimed he raped her in Sweden. We can draw our own conclusions what happened there precisely, but there's one obvious conclusion that comes to my mind and it goes without saying.

The Russians don't worry me greatly in the Baltics. They worry me more elsewhere. The fact is the Baltics are not resource rich countries, unlike Ukraine. Unless there was some kind of compelling national security threat, it's difficult to imagine why Russia would invade these countries. Russian threats to these countries are more surreptitious in nature.

It's more believable that an outside force would want to drag Russia into occupying the Baltics than the Russians conducting a false flag of their own. A similar example would be how Turkey is using Azerbaijan to start a war with Armenia in the hopes of drawing Russia into defense of Armenia so as to distract from Libya and Syria, where both Russia and Turkey seek to exert influence through competing military force. A further example occurred with Georgia in 2007. This was during an election year and it was a test meant to paint Obama weak on foreign policy in comparison to McCain.

The idea that NATO would do nothing if Russia invaded the Baltics belies the fact that Russia would be hit with heavy sanctions that would hurt their economy significantly and that would fully signal the start of a new Cold War, something Russia simply cannot afford. They're economy is not strong enough for the challenges of a new Cold War.

And to clarify, I'm not a Russia or Putin apologist. I strongly suspect Russia hacked the emails from the DNC and had them republished by WikiLeaks. It was very likely a tit-for-tat response for Hillary's meddling in Putin's election when she was Secretary of State. Furthermore, Russia's goal was not to help Trump get elected, but rather to hurt Hillary's ability to govern as president by exposing how the primaries were effectively rigged in her favor over Sanders, thus alienating many people on the left.

Walrus

Firstly, I recommend we apply the golden rule. Do we use honey traps? Of course! Would we compromise, then blackmail a Russian soldier? You betcha! I wonder how many Russian defence personnel are on our payroll?

.....Of course we do this for the purest of motives; to freedomise the world as we see it. The Russians and Chinese? They do it for pure evil. That is the difference between us.

As for hacking, do we hack the Russians? Are you kidding? Would we ever interfere in other people’s elections? Naww, but if we did, it would only be to save people from Russian evil.

Now what happens if Russia decides to establish military bases in Cuba and Venezuela, purely for defence of course? Isn’t that exactly the same as Estonia and Latvia entertaining NATO? Of course, but when we do it it’s for good purposes, when Russians do it, it’s to spread evil.

We have squandered whatever moral authority we had to even make a case for objecting to Russian and Chinese behaviour.

Fred

Walrus,

you mean we should be 'gentlemen' and ladies and not use espionage against our adversaries? Just kidding, their interference is expected. What GCHQ and that Ambassador from Down Under did to us, that's inexcusable.

"what happens if Russia decides to establish military bases in Cuba and Venezuela"
Great idea, I'm sure Cuba and Venezuela could use the money. Does Russia have alot of extra cash available for that? How's the logistics tail going to work on whatever they deploy down that way?

J

Russia already has a base in Cuba, it's called Lourdes.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Lourdes_SIGINT_station

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