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04 August 2020

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Mark Logan

Larry,

"Hooping" more commonly, and in this context clearly, playing basketball.

John from Michigan

Larry:

Do you really think the truth matters ?

fakebot

I don't think Chauvin will be exonerated, but there is no question advocates of the racist police brutality narrative are ignoring facts.

The conclusion of the private autopsy requested by the family was wrong. They didn't know the results of the toxicology report. One of the experts hired by the family, who kept making television appearances (including on Hannity), didn't even look at the body. To the best of my knowledge, this man only saw the video and ruled it a homicide on that basis alone. Another expert hired by the family saw the body, but again she didn't see the toxicology report. The lawyer for the family, Ben Crump, is an ass for calling the toxicology report a red herring.

The fact is when the store clerks called the cops, they said Floyd appeared drunk. He was clearly inebriated or intoxicated. The fact he handed off an obviously fake $20 bill suggests he wasn't all there. There is no denying the toxicology report which does prove he was intoxicated. And the police were right to apprehend him. This Floyd was inebriated or intoxicated while sitting behind the wheel of a car, so he clearly represented a danger if he began to drive.

With all that being said, despite the fact he had trouble breathing beforehand doesn't exclude that the manner he was being detained had contributed to his death. The second autopsy (I'm not talking the private one, but the official second autopsy) officially did rule his death a homicide because the manner he was held down was deemed a contributing factor in his death.

In my personal opinion, I think there is a case to be made that Chauvin did recognize Floyd and deliberately kept Floyd on his stomach, with his face pointed downward, so that Floyd wouldn't recognize Chauvin. Maybe Chauvin was also trying to pass Floyd out or induce Floyd to vomit something he may have swallowed to hide from the police, who knows, but the manner Floyd was held down, even if it is considered accepted albeit rare procedure, will not hold in front of a jury. Procedures aside, there has to be common sense.

turcopolier

fakebot

A conviction will be appealed on the basis of a willful disregard of evidence, and then the situation will get interesting.

John from Michigan

fakebot:

There is no question Chauvin's actions were excessive and he should be disciplined for that. However, unless his actions were the primary cause of death it is not murder. It is all a moot point though. Everyone on that jury knows if they vote to acquit their life and livelihood will be at risk as well as those of their close family members. Hopefully there will be at least one courageous juror with integrity but I doubt it.

JerseyJeffersonian

Mark Logan,

Here is the top definition of this slang term at Urban Dictionary:

https://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Hooping

So not in this context os it a reference to playing basketball. And do you really think it likely that this overweight guy with circulatory problems, a long time drug user, and by his own claim just coming off of a dose of WuFlu was recreating himself playing basketball earlier on?

This strains credulity.

JM Gavin

If the police officers are acquitted in a state trial, they will be found guilty in a federal civil rights trial. These four officers are going to spend years in prison, as will the officer in Atlanta. The politicians, POTUS included, will be happy to ensure this outcome.

It would be better if the officers were turned over to the mob, shot to death, and then set afire. The mob can drag their charred remains through the street, chanting slogans, and then hang their remains from a bridge. There's a great bridge on the outskirts of Fallujah that served this purpose in the past.

Things are what they are, not what they should be.

JM Gavin

JerseyJeffersonian

Mark Logan,

According to a poster in another blog comment section, "hooping" can also refer to ingesting drugs by means of an enema, actually an effective way to absorb them into the body. Millions of AIDS sufferers (and sufferers from other STDs) can't be wrong! This area is a weak link in the body's defenses against intruders, whether viral, bacterial, or chemical. Besides, ingestion via enema avoids problems such as visible track marks (awkward to explain to LEOs or parole officers), and being found in possession of "works", i.e., syringes, spoons for "cooking" with a lighter, or hydrating the drugs into an injectable form.

As a long term convict, I am sure George was quite familiar with secreting items in his rectum, so an enema would be child's play.

JM Gavin

fakebot,
"There is no question Chauvin's actions were excessive?" His actions appear to be consistent with his training and MPD policy, and yet you've figured out that the actions were excessive?

JM Gavin

Deap

Excellent.

Every elected official who claimed the police killed Floyd and every media report that claimed the police killed Floyd, and everyone who republished this claim need to be sued- slander per se, false accusation of a crime.

I assume there will be no problem claiming damages, and even punitive damages due to willful intent to defame, by all the wrongly accused police officers.

This lynching of the police officers was media defamation of the Covington Catholic Kids...... on steroids.

JamesT

By charging him with murder and not manslaughter, the DA was intentionally putting Chauvin into a good position to get off. I'm no BLM supporter, but watch the tape and tell me that Chauvin is not guilty of manslaughter.

Deap

fakebot, "homicide" means a person died, and that it did not initially appear to be a suicide. However OD by drugs could be called a suicide. We also have the cruel phenomenon of "suicide by cop" where someone sets up a scenario to die at the hands of a police officer, or a passing train, or motor vehicle.

You are reading way more into this incident than supported by the facts in evidence. Why is that? Or even supported by the facts in evidence when the toxicology report first came out. It was not clear from that point forward how in fact Floyd died.

Now that the embers have died down, vicious political lines drawn, the Nation convulsed, the additional bodies counted, and the damages assessed to the point the Minnesota Gov is now begging for a federal bailout, it is a strange time to finally officially release this contemporaneous and potentially exculpatory evidence.

Terence Gore

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=oSr0YJm34CU

The take from the CBC TV reporters is G. Floyd said he couldn't breathe many times with the implication the officers deliberately ignored it.

Eric Newhill

Larry,
I mostly agree. First, the hold that Cauvin used was, as you have noted, is approved by department policy. It would have been used to keep both Floyd and the cops safe. It might look terrible to the untrained eye and present as the ultimate archetype in a paranoid ink blot test, but it is a safe and effective means of controlling someone when used properly. I demonstrated to some friends recently by having my wife (125 pounds +/-) apply the hold to me (200 + pounds, mostly muscle). I could not get up or thrash too much. I was a controlled, yet unharmed. The assumption has been from the beginning that Chauvin was applying his total weight to Floyd's neck. With one knee on the ground, the amount of pressure applied by the other knee, to the neck, can be completely regulated and need not be excessive. Anyone can verify this by simply trying it instead of repeating what they have been told by the media. If you are worried about hurting a partner, try it on an inanimate object. Everyone is so into "science", but then unwilling to test a basic hypothesis before virtue signaling away.

Where I think Chauvin screwed up is in not giving Floyd CPR, etc once he stopped breathing. However, that is not murder. The excessive charges are a set up for subsequent riots; probably worse than the first round, when Chauvin is acquitted at trial or on appeal. Maybe that is intentional.

Eric Newhill

Terence Gore,
The problem is that people resisting arrest often say things like, "I can't breath". Often enough that cops see it as crying wolf. Besides, what were the cops supposed to do with someone who is thrashing and resisting arrest and saying he can't breath? Let him thrash and hurst himself and/or cops? All they could do was control Floyd for safety while waiting on the EMTs.

Oilman2

Based on the comments ahead of me, there will be no resolution of this matter that is not democratic - in other words, a compromise both sides hate.

The 'racism' narrative never did fit; their previous work history together is not spoken of at any length; their former employer and the background of that establishment is also very interesting.

Multi-racial myself, this entire BLM things is fueled more by wealth or opportunity disparity than anything else. It's a game many of us just refuse to play any longer, but nobody can fix stupid - it has to fix itself.

Terence Gore

Eric

Understood, I was trying to make the point MSM is not taking a deeper look the is at the issue.

"Some drugs produce undesirable effects with an oral application. With rectal administration, a person who typically feels nauseous from taking a certain substance orally may be able to avoid that feeling. A person may also want to experience the “high” more quickly in certain situations. For example, a person may seek social competence and emotional awareness associated with MDMA when at social gatherings, and may want to produce the effects of it more quickly than usual. Or a person who wants the relaxed and calm feelings associated with alcohol may want to orally administer it to have the effects of it while not emitting the smell on his breath.

This is a trend becoming more and more popular with teens as a way to get the desired effects while hiding (at least for a while) the evidence of abuse. Whatever the reason a person may rectally abuse substances, there are blatant side effects ranging from mild to severe."

https://www.rehabcenter.net/dangers-rectally-administering-drugs/

I would think the average jury would find Pluggin/hooping a very risky behavior

Bobo

Floyd was inebriated from his drug ingestion and once apprehended needed to be restrained due to his impairment. Once on the ground, his suggestion, Chauvin applied a restraint to Floyd’s scapula and repeatedly applied pressure in a throttling manner. Was it the neck and not the scapula, that’s in the eye of the viewer and camera angle. Never believe what you think you see as there always Is another angle. Oh, yes he did slip it to the neck but for how long time will tell.
He applied the restraint way to long, he did not allow the body to be turned as suggested and reacted poorly to the growing crowd. A professional law enforcement trainer of restraint holds could answer most questions and will in court but with the quick condemnation by law enforcement agencies answers most questions. Homicide 1st or 2nd degree only in Minneapolis.

Fred

Congratulations to Keith Ellison, former congressman, former vice chair of the DNC, and current Attorney General of Minnesota. Suppressing this evidence was essential in ensuring the myth of George Floyd was spread around the world before even a flicker of fact emerged.

"We found a weed pipe on him, there might be something else with it. Might be like, PCP or something."
Tomas Lane, Minneapolis PD. That's the "systemicly racist" police department in that city run by the Democratic Farm Labor party, which, like the Attorney General's office of the State of Minneapolis, has been in charge for half a century or more.

Congratulations Democrats. You have shown the world that you believe that individual idenity must be rejected in favor of group identity, guilt for things done in the past is inheritable, and only one group has lives that matter. History must be replaced with the new reality, the Democratic party's belief that America was founded on racism, it's institutions, codes of law, and culture must all be swept asside to be replaced with the ideals of the "democratic socialist" wing of the party.

Chaz, Chop and CNN couldn't frame a better narrative to run for election on in 2020. Better get some Covid cover stories going lest people start asking why men and women are fined or arrested for trying to open barber shops, walk without a face burka in public, or otherwise excercise freedoms yet looters, arsonists, and destroyers of public monuments walk free; along with tens of thousands of criminals who were released from prison. Certainly no one wants to know why FISA abuse has gone unpunished, why DOJ lawyers can make up evidence, withhold other material from defendants - repeatedly, yet none are arrested or otherwise held to account. We certainly don't want to know what Joe Biden and his boss were doing those 8 years they were in office; or all the other years Joe spent in the House and Senate.

Charile Wilson

Fentanyl and other opioids do NOT cause respiratory distress or shortness of breath. They generally depress all activity of the brain and especially the area that control respiration. In a large enough dose you first pass out and then stop breathing. That is why most opiate overdoses are simply found dead. A guy foaming at the mouth, agitated and wanting to lie down is sick, and should be treated as such. He should not be cuffed with his hands behind his back (also a stress position which impedes the motion of the chest and hence effective breathing), made to lie prone (also an impediment to ability to breathe) with a knee on the back of the neck which will compress the upper airway. This guy may have been a SOB and a MOFO but did not deserve this for any reason let alone passing a bad $20 bill. It was not murder in the first, but some blame needs to be allocated.

Out of the way, it's a busy day
I've got things on my mind
For want of the price of tea and a slice
The old man died

"Us and Them", Pink Floyd

Thomas Sears MD, FACC

First, let me explain that I am a retired Cardiologist (ABIM Certified in both Internal Medicine and Cardiology). As such, have on thousands of occasions helped in the ER’s when people come in on drugs....and I have seen the panic in their eyes and the physiologic changes that occur (severe hypertension, Adrenalin release, heart attacks, strokes).

When I read the available reports from Floyd’s autopsy I was struck by the fact this fellow had ingested a large quantity of dangerous drugs; combinations of stimulants and opioids (fentanyl...one of the most dangerous drugs on the street...we even have to be careful with it in the hospital). He wasn’t able to react appropriately to the circumstances and those officers aren’t doctors. The officers were trapped. The only decision they could make was to control the subject and try to prevent him from injuring himself or them...or someone else. From what I read in the Minneapolis PD manual the use of the neck restraint (as they used it) was trained and approved.

Factually, this probably didn’t cause an injury. I think the defense will probably utilize this; perhaps they will get a ‘slap on the hands’...but they did what they were trained to do with a large, strong, resisting subject. I am worried that it will result in a ‘ Rodney King’ response with riots and destruction. I don’t see a good ‘end’ here.

Babak makkinejad

Charlie Wilson

I agree.

I am reminded of a piece by Art Buchwald, in which, he quoted the response of a governor of Illinois to a prison riot: " we need a better class of prisoners."

I suppose we need a healthier and more responsible-acting class of miscreants, who could endure incidents of police brutality and not inconviently dying and besmirching the sterling reputation of the police - causing riots among the feeble-minded population.

Deap

Charlie Wilson, why the intentional misinformation campaign when we all have search engines at our fingertips?

"........According to the Drug Enforcement Administration, this powerful drug is 100 times more potent than morphine and 50 times more potent than heroin. Along with targeting the opioid receptors in the brain that control pain, the opioid receptors that control breathing and heart rate are also affected. This can lead an individual to stop breathing all together if too much Fentanyl is taken.........

EMT was called, he was being symptomatically treated. He did not die because of a bad $20 bill. He died because from the moment he woke up that day he made one fatal decision after another, all bad. Including buying cigarette with his bad $20 bill, when he claimed on tape he had "post-covid breathing" problems. He set his own fate in motion.

Might want to wait for the start of the woke NFL season before doing any more Monday morning quarterbacking.

Terence Gore

CHF is associated with cardiomegaly which is associated with SOB
(shortness of breadth)

From the autopsy

A. Arteriosclerotic heart disease, multifocal, severe

B. Hypertensive heart disease

1. Cardiomegaly (540 g) with mild biventricular

dilatation

2. Clinical history of hypertension

1. Fentanyl 11 ng/mL

2. Norfentanyl 5.6 ng/mL

3. 4-ANPP 0.65 ng/mL

4. Methamphetamine 19 ng/mL

5. 11-Hydroxy Delta-9 THC 1.2 ng/mL;

Delta-9 Carboxy THC 42 ng/mL; Delta-9 THC 2.9 ng/mL

6. Cotinine positive

7. Caffeine positive"

https://www.paulcraigroberts.org/2020/07/08/the-medical-examiners-report-of-george-floyds-death/

Methamphetamine most often causes a general feeling of wellness (euphoria) that is most often called a "rush." Other symptoms are increased heart rate, increased blood pressure, and large, wide pupils.

If you take a large amount of the drug, you will be at higher risk for more dangerous side effects, including:

Agitation
Chest pain
Coma or unresponsiveness (in extreme cases)
Heart attack
Irregular or stopped heartbeat
Difficulty breathing
Very high body temperature
Kidney damage and possibly kidney failure
Paranoia
Seizures
Severe stomach pain
Stroke
Long-term use of methamphetamine can lead to significant psychological problems, including:

Delusional behavior
Extreme paranoia
Major mood swings
Insomnia (severe inability to sleep)
Other symptoms may include:

Missing and rotted teeth (called "meth mouth")
Repeated infections
Severe weight loss
Skin sores (abscesses or boils)
The length of time methamphetamines stay active can be much longer than for cocaine and other stimulants. Some paranoid delusions can last for 15 hours."

https://www.mountsinai.org/health-library/poison/methamphetamine-overdose

"Common signs of opiate or stimulant overdose are:

foaming at the mouth or a foam cone
loss of consciousness
seizures
difficulty or stopped breathing
Overdose causes foaming at the mouth because organs like the heart and lungs can’t function properly. Slowed heart or lung movements causes fluids to gather in the lungs, which can mix with carbon dioxide and come out of the mouth like a foam."

https://www.healthline.com/health/foaming-at-the-mouth#causes

AK

Eric Newhill,

"The excessive charges are a set up for subsequent riots; probably worse than the first round, when Chauvin is acquitted at trial or on appeal. Maybe that is intentional."

I thought this the moment I heard the charges were bumped up from 3rd to 2nd degree murder. IMHO, this was also unquestionably a prime motive for the Atlanta DA to rush to charge that officer with felony 1st degree murder. I don't know how a prosecutor could prove to an impartial jury that this was first degree, pre-meditated murder, given the indisputable facts of the case.

I firmly believe both of these cases have been deliberately set up to fail in prosecution in order to effect a truly cataclysmic round of domestic unrest upon the results of the trials. The need the system to fail in order to prove their contention that it is inherently racist. These people want power at all costs. They do not care one bit about the citizenry of their municipalities who undoubtedly will suffer mightily once these trials play out to acquittal or at best a hung jury.

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