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31 August 2020

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blue peacock

Major plans must be afoot to ratchet up the violence if Trump wins the election. What will the Trumpers do, if Biden wins?

My guess is the TDS violence will be restricted to Democrat run cities. Will the Trumper violence if they have a similar rage against the machine if Biden wins be restricted to Republican cities?

EEngineer

Mayor Wheeler has gone full on TDS. His latest TV appearance blaming President Trump for all of Portland's troubles is a textbook display of cognitive dissonance.

I have a good secure job but I'm now actively seeking to leave Portland, and the left coast behind. Folks who can design high power, high density, multi-phase switching regulators and the complicated drive electronics that control them do not grow on trees. My company has been trying to hire someone to help with the project backlog since the end of last year to no avail. Good luck when there are none left...

Eric Newhill

Sir,
The reason I, sadly, think you may be right is that the mayors and governors appear to be supporting the leftist rioters; or at least allowing them to continue. The Gov of WI says that Trump isn't welcome in Kenosha (which Trump plans to visit).

If it was just little socialist jerks running amuck and the government - local and federal - trying to stop them and denouncing them, as in the 60s - I would think the civil war scenario off base. However, with the socialist rioters receiving, at least, tacit support at both the federal and local level, I don't see how this resolves short of dissolution of the country or violence to maintain the union.

The democrats are already creating a mindset to reject the election results. The republicans are falling into the same. IMO, trump is going to win big time, but if no one on the left accepts the win, well it won't be pretty. If Biden does win, they will come after conservatives with a vengeance. That will foment violence. I'm stacking magazines.

Fourth and Long

Mayor Ted Wheeler's terms are four years. He last ran in 2016, took office in January 2017. I thought his statements yesterday to be off the mark but after checking those dates decided my initial take was probably correct, namely that he's running for reelection and therefore goes anti-Trump all the time to the max. Typical politician's response killing two birds at one go -- score easy popularity points while best of all evading the question completely and any danger of being held accountable.

My guess is Biden and the Dems cut a deal with Clyburn for the Carolina primary result: you want this primary? Then BLM is golden and hands off.

Biden is supposed to speak today in PA.

wtofd

What can we do to stop the distrust and hatred on both sides?

505thPIR

Hardly Ft. Sumter and not a John Brown moment either. A block or two of nightly theater in Portland is simply a petri-dish magnified by the media and political manipulators of all stripes. Shoot, it is a perfect fly trap to vector all the extremists right and left into domestic intel files. It inflames public opinion on all sides, but hardly makes a Civil War inevitable. Domestic terrorism and political violence here and there,sure.

How is this and the other notable incidents of the past months going to manifest themselves a fissile chain reaction that amounts to a true civil war and all that would entail? Would someone in the committee who is of that belief please lay out the cookbook for the now stated "coming civil war"? Saying it has already started begs the question, "Why do you believe this is such? Why?"

Looking at the long rich history of SST, how has it become so "stove-piped" on the right-left divide over the past year?

Vegetius

The whole Willamette Valley down to Eugene is filled with Marxists, hippies, and other assorted degenerates and has eight of Oregon's ten biggest cities in it.

jerseycityjoan

I don't think civil war is here. Certainly the Antifa people do not speak for me. But I would say that people who start trouble -- from either side -- are taking a risk of a violent response.

Here is what the article said about the victim:

"In disturbing footage, recorded by videographer Justin Dunlap, the victim, later identified as Danielson, appears to be following two other people down a street before two gunshots ring out and a cloud of smoke erupts at the source."

"Dunlap, the [Associated Press] videographer, claimed that the victim had been macing people prior to the shooting.

In his video someone could be heard shouting that the man was a 'motherf**ker who has been pushing people and jumping people the entire time'.

'That guy has been f**king with people the entire time,' the witness shouted.

The people showing up to these events are riled. I feel very sorry for the law enforcement officers who have to deal with them.

JM Gavin

Blue Peacock,
The current conflict playing out in Democrat-run cities isn't between those who support Donald Trump and those who support Joe Biden.

DOL,

JMG

turcopolier

505th PIR

This is a life or death situation in which the nature of the country is at stake. If the Democrats take over it is the end of the world as I know it.

akaPatience

Why aren't Antifa and BLM characterized as "left wing" groups in reportage yet Patriot Prayer is labeled "right wing"? Why is being avowedly Christian and waving American flags even considered "right wing"? What's worse, the NYT characterized Patriot Prayer as "far right", as though to excuse the victim's murder. BLM leaders openly proclaim they're Marxist so it's not as though calling them "far left" is part of any conspiracy theory.

The MSM have blood on their hands. God help us.

ked

I have friends in Portland & visited the city & nearby Pacific Coast last year. Seemed to be a fairly typical NW city of its size & age. I think the tension is (& will continue to be) correlated with strong two-party states having an urban / rural lifestyle divide. Gaming the angst is what pro pols do when they’re more interested in power than governing.

JM Gavin

COL Lang,
While I agree that the nation's future is at stake in this election, I also don't believe that the BLM/Antifa crowd are Biden voters (although the Democrats appear to believe this is the case). BLM/Antifa intends to tear down the current system; Biden is more a product and representative of the system than Trump.

Should Biden win, he is going to have to deal with the anarchists. This is far more difficult than armchair quarterbacking Trump from a basement in Delaware. While Biden and Harris may or may not be up to the task, the unrest will continue regardless of the election's outcome.

DOL,

JMG

Mark K Logan

Vegetis,

Eugene dominated by Marxists? Corvallis?? Beg to differ.

Portland is a strange place. We think of it as Seattle's little sister who spent a summer in Europe and returned insufferable. There are bastions of liberal arts like Reed College (Steve Jobs went there) which has produced some remarkably free thinkers, but Oregon and Oregon State are hard to distinguish from most mid-western universities. Nothing specially leftist in the politics there.

They think they know who the shooter was. It appears to have been a nutcase who acted alone. Not all that different from the guy who drove his car into the crowd at Charlotte, simply partaking in a different flavor Kool Aid, it is to be hoped.

Barbara Ann

505thPIR

We are seeing the beginnings of (lethal) sectarian violence. The path to wider conflict is, I would contest, depressingly straightforward: More tit for tat killings and then maybe someone high profile becomes a victim on one side - Rand Paul came close the other day by his own account. That mobilizes the other side for revenge on a wider scale. The National Guard is called in to try and keep the peace and maybe a Kent State like event happens. Widespread civil disorder and anarchy in cities follow as LE is overwhelmed. Each side organizes along paramilitary lines. Gradually everyone is forced to choose a side.

The enormous ideological chasm between the belligerents seems unbridgeable. America today is starting to remind me of of the Troubles in Northern Ireland where the mutual distrust and hatred between 2 communities led to no go areas for each. I will never forget traveling from town to town (and in Belfast street to street) noting the painted curbstones; red white and blue for Protestant, Loyalist areas and green white and orange ones for Catholic, Republican ones. Can't happen in America? Really, what then was the CHAZ?

One key factor making wider conflict more likely is the complete polarization at the political level. Neither side seems interested in engaging with the other to defuse the situation. Quite the contrary in fact, both parties are intent on upping the rhetoric and both feel the coming election is of existential importance. And if it does happen, the widespread availability of firearms among the population will ensure it is a bloody affair.

I would reverse your question and ask for a description of a plausible path to peace and reconciliation - or at least stability - from here. I would be genuinely interested to hear one.

Polish Janitor

I still can't understand how a city with so much humidity, many many rainy days and overcast whether year-round can have all this destructive energy to go out and protest and destroy... Of course not every citizen-young or old- there is automatically predisposed to radicalization, but my question is how did Seattle or Oakland or San Francisco-all staunchly liberal dominions- became what they are now? These liberal states have been democrat-run for decades, why snapping now? I'm no Trump fan, in fact I lean more libertarian and paleo-ish thus I have my criticisms of a number of his policies, but hey just a few months ago the economy was running at full speed, unemployment down to historical levels, no nation-building wars abroad, black and latino employment level at historic high and now this?

In another (realted) news, the sheriff of Kenosha said the other day that more than half of those arrested by the local law enforcement responsible for the looting and burning and other related unlawful activities have come from the outside of the state.

People, businesses, decent law-abiding citizens, investments, companies and every other positive element that make a city flourish is fleeting from Chicago, New York, Seattle, and other major democrat-run cities. As these cities become insecure, destabilized and mob-run the liberal 'intelligencia' frames these as reparations for slavery. In fact there is this bill going through the California state senate that would sign reparations into law. Just never mind that California joined the union as a free state in 1850 and never had a history of slavery, but hey who listens these days? As a believer in natural law, I have decided to keep my cool and let nature to its thing and sort things out as it has had in the past.

NancyK

The end of the world as you know it, but not the end of the world or the end of our democracy. There is so much fear mongering now that I think the average person just wants to turn of the TV and say good night to all of the agitators on Fox, CNN or even blogs. There is too much hate and it isn't Biden who is stoking it. Trump very well might win the election again, I sincerely hope not but it could well be. I think there will be civil unrest with rioting, civil disobedience and acts of violence but civil war? I don't think so. But then again I could be wrong.

jerseycityjoan

Well the nature of the country has been changing and will continue to change. We did this through the mass migration of the last 40 years. There is no going back on that. If we had any sense we would greatly cut down on immigration in the future but I am not sure that we will. I will do my part and vote for Trump in November and continue to complain about him every day.

I would also point out that the Republican Party is an outlier in many respects as compared to the conservative parties of other countries. I myself cannot see how you can have a "small government" in a First World country of 330 million people. I was just reminded today by one of the immigration reduction organizations that Pew Research predicts we will have 441 million by 2065, with almost all the increase due to immigrants and their descendants.

I can only hope that we retain the essential and important things about America as change we never asked for keeps coming. Of course everybody has their own idea about what is essential and important. I can also only hope that people will start saying NO and doing something about our real and serious and often ignored problems.

BillWade

I can see it evolving into: "they got one of us, let's get one of their's" and escalating out of control.

President Trump will likely win, I've started reading a few Democrat blogs and the feel I'm getting is that moderate Dems are going to vote Trump, they are fed up with their party's antics. I sure hope this is the case.

Things seem more or less normal in SW Florida. Most of the restaurants are open, the kids are back in school just today, my wife did her daily polling this morning while on her walk, 1 Biden sign to 7 Trump signs. In 2016 the ratio was about 50 to 1 for Trump but it's early yet.

turcopolier

jerseycityjoan

if the Democrats take charge your descendants will be an oppressed minority.

turcopolier

NancyK

Yes, you are wrong! You know nothing about the nature of the people you favor. I fought them all over the world. I know! You dream!

AK

Vegetius,

This is correct. I live in Corvallis, and it is a town with soft hands and soft hearts through and through. The people here are far to the left, but they are reserved in their expression of their leftism insofar as public disturbances go. If I had to choose one word to describe this place, it would be "precious." We are making plans to leave with haste. On the way out of town, I will drive with my knees so as to be able to flip the place both of my middle fingers.

The areas in the countryside are another matter. Very pro-2A, very patriotic, and very pro-Trump. But these people are far outnumbered by the crazies in all of those population centers you mention, so the state will continue to devolve into socialist madness, with the shitstorm that is Portland leading the way. I can't wait to get out of here.

Diana Croissant

Should people be discussing the role of someone else in this violence? Remember that often supplies are somehow brought in on pallets to help the rioters cause damage and mayhem.

I remember feeling strongly that George Soros was greatly involved in Obama's election: from campaign contributions coming from out of the country (which should be illegal) to many other nefarious campaign behaviors. Soros is also often mentioned in the same sentences as Hillary is mentioned.

I know that mentioning George Soros often causes people to scoff and claim "conspiracy theory." But the evidence is clear--ANTIFA goons can't be causing their mayhem all over the country while supporting themselves with a monthly gift from Mom and Dad. And they are just too busy causing trouble to have jobs that could support them.

I also think of the, too me, creepy Bohemian Grove group of men--actually pretty close to the part of the country we are discussing. Powerful Men--as we've learned recently from The Epstein scandal--can easily dismiss and ignore the morals and mores of us common folk.

I also don't believe that local or state Democratic Party officials would have the money or the desire to support clearly violent people.

I've been to Portland, too. I always felt it more what I used to call "hippie-dippie" liberal. One could talk with them and nod without agreeing with them and certainly without actually engaging them in a political discussion. That would have broken the "cool vibes" of the place.

There has to be a cause/source for this horrible emphasis on violence in politics.

It certainly can in some way be charged to the very stupid graduate students teaching undergrad classes on socialism and Marxism. But the support for violence and actual carnage is provided by someones's money.

Which of our alphabet agencies should be actively investigating the monetary support for training and supplying these young goons?

Bobo

If one enters Antifa.com on their browser you will be redirected to Joe Biden’s fundraising website. To me this relationship between Biden and Antifa indicates Biden-Harris support the actions of Antifa. I learned of this connection today and understand it has been there for a while which is very sad. Now it’s not only BLM & Antifa against the American Citizenry and its governments joined by Old Joe and Clever Kamala.

Fred

wtofd,

Berniebro James Hodgkinson attempted to assisinate Steve Scalise and 20+ other Republican members of the House of Representatives. Please remind us all when Nancy Pelosi and 20+ democrats were shot at by "the other side". Less that a week ago another group of BLM/Antifa staged a "mostly peaceful" protest against Senator Rand Paul, who had previously been attacked and hospitalized by another Berniebro. Feel free to remind us all when that happened to Nancy, Chuck or any other Democratic leader.

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