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12 June 2020

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Cold War Colonel

The mayor (herrronner?) and the governor are trying to look the other way and deny that the occupiers have guns, have established borders, checkpoints, are demanding money from citizens caught in CHAZ, etc. No problem, they say, just citizens exercising their constitutional rights peacefully. To paraphrase Groucho Marx, who are we to believe, the mayor/governor or our own eyes?

Political scientists define government as the institution with the monopoly on the use of force. CHAZ is a defacto government competing with the city, state and federal governments.

Colonel, your comments are spot on. What is to prevent this from happening elsewhere where local authorities will not exercise their lawful authority?

This makes me yearn for leaders like Frank Rizzo again.

zm

Not quite the Euromaidan yet, but getting there. Things can get out of control so quickly and so drastically. Sad.

eakens

Washington State has no state income tax. The Federal Government has a lot of power.

plantman

Reasonable people-- on either side of the aisle-- can agree that we cannot allow parts of our cities to be handed over to the rabble. Jenny Durkin is letting her personal ideology cloud her judgement. The crisis needs to be addressed swiftly and with as much force as needed. Seizing public land and private property has nothing to do with BLM or racial justice, it's a flagrant powergrab by criminals and opportunists who should be held accountable for their actions.

The lack of clearsightedness seems to have overtaken the entire democratic party which seems to think there is some "gray area" in this matter. But there isn't. It's cut and dry for anyone with half a brain.

I live just north of Seattle, and I'll tell you, there are alot of people who can't wait to vote these goofballs out of office.

chris moffatt

Why would they not? They most certainly will in any jurisdiction where they feel the authorities are either compliant or lack the will to resist. This situation has been planned by the anarchists for a long time and can now only be resolved by force. Trump had better fire Milley and move on this very quickly. There is presidential precedent for this going back to Sheay's rebellion.

Deap

Don't spread this "liberation" around geographically - concentrate it all in Seattle. Let it be the magnet city for all those who want a totally free, autonomous lifestyle, but NO foreign aid from the US allowed.

I do support "space" dedicated for those who chose not to participate in productive activity and provide for their own food and shelter. But confine his location to one dedicated "freedom area" only; not spread it a around.

One way bus tickets to Seattle provided by non-profits should do the trick and clean up this "homeless" mess once and for all. Thank you Seattle for drawing the short straw. You're it.

From WTO to the nation's LOO, there could not be a more deserving city. You gave us Starbucks, Amazon, Microsoft and now finally the answer to vagrancy and lawlessness. A grateful nation thanks you.

Deap

Seeds of Seattle anarchy well planted and cultivated by its non-response to its recent invasion of vagrant camps. How was this any different than being taken over by radical separatists?

A must see documentary, produced well before this current insurrection that the mayor insists will breathe new life into this already fractious town. "Seattle is Dying": https://topdocumentaryfilms.com/seattle-dying/

The Twisted Genius

The federal government let the Bundys and their armed followers hold the Malheur Wildlife Refuge HQ for 40 days before taking them into custody. There were armed standoffs with the Bundys on and off for several years preceding that. The nation endured those challenges. We'll endure CHAZ which looks more like a hippie commune/street party than an armed standoff.

CHAZ is not autonomous at all. It still has city water and power. The concrete barriers were removed to all emergency services to enter CHAZ. This removal was done with the mutual agreement between CHAZ and the Seattle government. Residents and businesses deny they are being taxed. Some have said they prefer this to the police gassing of the area. This AZ will either melt away or morph into some kind of equilibrium with the city. It can't sustain itself as is. This is another instance where we should not fall prey to hysteria.

Zed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iQ9-fBPjdG0&feature=share

https://medium.com/@emilypothast/what-the-f-ck-is-going-on-in-seattle-48efbe6214f8.

The local perspective.

Deap

......"Personally, I’m excited for Chaz. And I can’t wait to see the utopia bloom.

But the name’s a bit of a short-changer. As the territory evolves, I recommend “Seattle Haven for Idealistic Triumph.”

It’s a different acronym, but something about it feels right."
(From: RedState)

Seattle
Haven for
Idealistic
Triumph

Deap

Why haven't we heard from the 500 or so private property owning residents who got trapped in this Seattle city council enabled miasma? If they are all good with this, then let them be.

But why are US based public utilities still serving this newly autonomous area when there are no cross-border agreements. Their neighbor Vancouver and the rest of Canada has effectively created a travel and tourism wall around their entire country.

Why is newly independent CHAZ still allowed to feed off the US? Of course, this new status means they are no longer US registered voters for any upcoming US elections

turcopolier

zed

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ws3LT598bL4

turcopolier

TTG

As I recall the Bundy problem, they did not claim to have detached the reserve from the US. They were upset about what they saw as misuse of the property. They believed that certain lands should be returned by the YSG to the states. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Occupation_of_the_Malheur_National_Wildlife_Refuge

BillWade

Their fledgling garden reminds me of an old Beavis and Butthead show, the boys were asked by their teacher what they would like to grow as part of a class project, they decided upon nachos.

Bill H

There is no principle or ideology involved in the state declining to break up that "protest" takeover. There is simply a lack of the courage required to do so.

The Twisted Genius

pl,

Bundy did not recognize federal police power or federal courts. He views were in line with the Sovereign Citizen Movement. More specifically, he wanted federal lands transferred to private ownership. His ranching operation was dependent on unfettered and free use of federal grazing land.

Seamus Padraig

@ Deap | 12 June 2020 at 11:54 AM

They tried something similar in Copenhagen in 1971, with mixed results ... but their anarchist collective, 'Freetown Christiania', still exists, albeit a little worse for the wear:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Freetown_Christiania

Deap

Zed, thank you for the local video which does give far more credence to the overall "block party" description, but the over all impression is also "Seattle So White". I hope you do have a summer of love in your city drawing in the world's disaffected, and they all ..... wear flowers in their hair.

Mark K Logan

As I mentioned in Harper's thread the Seattle police are pulling the chair, a basketball reference, on the protesters. It will be interesting to see how that plays out but it's currently "so far so good."

The protesters became obsessed on the east side precinct HQ for whatever reason, now they "have" it. We all must be careful what we wish for. Next night the protesters were down to a couple dozen hard core and the local residents are now the ones giving them grief, not the cops.

Deap

The Copenhagen "autonomous" community is on an island (peninsula?) and far removed from their downtown. You can view it on a canal boat tour. I believe it was the site of a former industrial or public utilities plant. Mixed reviews locally, but does not intrude on surrounding metropolitan area.

Key West has a similar nearby offshore island that is a free for all described by some as either pure heaven or pure hell, depending on their perspective. Not sure what its current state is today - waste management was its biggest concern.

Zurich tried its "needle park" free drug use zone, but that also failed. One may need to include strict isolation as a criteria for autonomous zones, before giving them any social credibility. Either they is or they ain't. And if they ain't they must live within the confines of polite society. Unless of course they are truly not asking for "freedom" and only want to be in your face contrarians.

Fred

TTG,

Which city is that NWR located in and how many civilians were barricaded inside with the Bundy's?

Barbara Ann

I disagree with @plantman's assessment that the Dems' reaction to this results from a lack of clearsightedness. They know exactly what they are doing in their silence or tacit support; it is yet another futile attempt at entrapment. The same people who defend the war on the constitutionally defensible secession of the states of the Confederacy will cry foul them moment force is used against the utterly unconstitutional Seattle Commune.

Trump knows this and his threats are, as usual, bluster. He can let CHAZ wither on the vine and simultaneously use it as an opportunity to show what happens when Fukuyamism-Lennonism (thank you DH) is left unchallenged.

Already libertarian maximalists are coming out of the woodwork to defend people's right to declare autonomous zones anywhere they like. I saw Hans-Hermann Hoppe cited somewhere. This fellow believes in the "..rights of property owners to establish private covenant communities." with the ability to exclude and eject people based on religion, sexual orientation and so on (wiki). To me this seems a sure recipe for the collapse of any sort of cohesive state. It is surely a short journey from Hoppe to Hobbes.

You are absolutely right to differentiate between the secession of a state (let Washington try it if they wish) and the anarchic takeover of part of a city, which is simple lawlessness. Hysterical hatred of Trump fomented and encouraged by the left and by the media has led to this. All the more grist to Trump's mill, roll on November.

phodges

It's a slow simmering Tahrir or Maidan. Just wait until they turn the rioter/protesters back on, in force, in November. I am planning a trip out of the country.

Funny thing is I lived adjacent to the to the 11th precinct for 10 years, and participated in the 1999 protests. My old apt is in the CHAZ. However, then, we were protesting for the government to FOLLOW the rule of law, rather than abandon us to corporate run globalist institutions. Which is now now Trumps position.

505th PIR

Let's see how it rolls. Walk softly and carry a big stick. If it go's south, document it and expose it for what it is. Then smack it.

Tidewater

Deap and TTG,

Private property owners are OK with it? 'Morph into equilibrium?'

Do you think business guys who have this happen to them would throw away the opportunity of a lifetime? There are going to be a lot of million dollar lawsuits against the city of Seattle over this, I will bet you. The suits will go on for years, and there will be big settlements. Ever heard of the Stockholm Syndrome?

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