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19 April 2020


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Yeah Right,

You fastened on the word “reprimand” it does not necessarily have the same meaning in China. In Australia it may mean a slap on the wrist with a wet lettuce leaf.

In China I’m fairly sure it means being threatened with serious punishment up to including execution.

People who criticize the Chinese Government routinely disappear permanently. I would think that only the doctors international visibility saved him from that fate.

Yeah, Right

Colonel, it doesn't matter what Cozier's motive was in writing those letters. Not in the slightest. What mattered to the Powers That Be was that Cozier made public something that he was not authorized to make public.

Was that doctor anything like that? Yeah, I believe so.

According to JJC the Chinese authorities were in official agency-to-agency communication with the WHO and the CDC by December-January.

They then find that a doctor who is not authorized to speak on behalf of that agency is shooting his mouth off.

Sorry, but that would not be tolerated by any organization - governmental, corporate, or anything in between.

There is nothing sinister about reprimanding someone for shooting your mouth off when you aren't authorized to do so, and definitely not when there are official discussions taking place between organizations.

I mean, honestly, how often have we all read a news article that contains something along the lines of "said a source who insisted on anonymity, as he was not authorized to speak on this topic".

And, no, you did not say I was a troll. But you are handing that card out to a lot of people, so it can't hurt for me to lay down my own marker.

A wise ass? Maybe. Yeah, OK, point taken. We actually agree more often than you might think.


Col. Lang,

Subject: Covert Action.

Detach the Chinese diaspora from the Mainland.

Offer them citizenship, education and money and the opportunity to start their own businesses.

I have yet to meet a Chinese who could pass up the offer of equity in a business.


Yeah Right

Crozier is a captain in the US Navy. Do you have any idea of the obligations that come with his rank? He is not an employee of the Navy. People do not die for their obligations to General Motors or any other crappy company.

blue peacock

"...the question will be of what sort of covert action will be approved in retaliation."

Col. Lang

Would you care to speculate based on your deep knowledge and experience?

IMO, of course from my limited lens, a huge vulnerability for the CCP is financial. Their banking system is massive relative to the size of their economy and heavily over-extended and saddled with growing NPLs. Their large corporate sector is substantially short USD with massive USD debt relative to their cash flows.

If I had to provide any advise. It would be to curtail eurodollar lending to CCP linked corporations and to incentivize the relocation of supply chains away from China which will further reduce availability of USD. And of course to prevent Fed dollar swaps from leaking to the CCP. I would also add the prevention of any US funds (pension, PE, hedge funds) from investing in Chinese companies and not allowing their listing on US exchanges.

To all those that say the CCP will price all their goods in Yuan and sell their USD reserves and crash the Treasury market, my response is dream on.


I am not a pro-communist troll either, nor did I just show up here. I've been enjoying SST's excellent coverage of the Russiagate fiasco for several years.

There are not opposing timelines here - there is an accepted public record of what occurred when, as reported internationally, and there's no room within it for any concerted coverup or delay. The record shows that the response was timely, followed protocol, and played out much like previous events. The decade old movie "Contagion" portrays these pandemic protocols. There is tremendous amount of international cooperation on the medical/science/preparation fronts, and the Chinese have not come under criticism over this event from those circles.

Doctors and nurses have been fired from hospitals in NYC and Chicago for speaking to the media without proper authorization.


Yeah, Right, er "wise ass",

I'm sorry to hear you haven't heard any of the other tales about the now very dead Dr. Li Wenliang, yet another victim of communism. Read for yourself:

"Chinese Authorities Admit Improper Response To Coronavirus Whistleblower"

"China issues 'solemn apology' to doctor reprimanded for early coronavirus warnings"

Thanks for the sophistry.



We here in Okieland lost a good soul to the CCP Virus. CMOH recipient Command Sgt. Maj. Bennie G. Adkins who was born in Waurika Oklahoma was 86 when he passed away at the East Alabama Medical Center ICU late last week.

CSM Adkins spent over 20 year of his tenure on this earth as a Green Beret. in the 3rd, 5th, 6th, 7th, SF Groups with 3 tours in Nam. Then-Sgt 1st Class Adkins survived 38 hours of close-combat against North Vietnamese forces March 9-12, 1966 while serving as an Intelligence Sergeant with Detachment A-102, 5th Special Forces Group, 1st Special Forces at Camp "A Shau", in the Republic of Vietnam.


Yeah, Right

Walrus, I am well aware of how pathetic an official reprimand is in Australia (Sydney, actually). But I believe you are letting your prejudice colour your judgement.

Read the article that Fred linked to. This doctor was one of eight doctors in Wuhan who were told (however heavy-handed) to STFU by the police.

Note that he returned to work following his reprimand. Note also that his case was taken up by the Supreme Court, who criticized the police.

Neither of those fact supports your "thinking" that he was marked to be "disappeared", only for him to be saved by the benevolent intervention of westerners. That is speculation, pure and simple, with more than a little hint of condescension.

Look, don't get me wrong: I have no doubt that being told to STFU by the Wuhan Police is a much more frightening prospect that being told to STFU by anyone in Sydney or Melbourne.

But even if that was the case, that does not affect the point I am making, which is this: if the Chinese had already opened inter-agency talks with the WHO and the CDC then it was always going to be intolerable to them that there be a group of doctors who are blabbering on in public about things they are not authorized to blab about.

No organization - not the Chinese, not the government of Scotty-from-marketing, not the Trump Administration - would tolerate that.

It wouldn't matter if what the CCP were telling the CDC was exactly the same as what those doctors were saying on social media.

It would make no difference, the authorities would be perfectly correct to tell them to STFU and leave this to the grown-ups.



"Offer them citizenship, education and money and the opportunity to start their own businesses. "

Let me get this right. Trump is supposed to tell tens of millions of American citizens that have lost thier jobs or businesses because of Communist China's actions that we are going to give citizens of communist China money "to start their own businesses" - to compete with the millions of Americans who've had their lives destroyed by communists in Beijing, and citizenship too? I decline to be economicly enslaved by taxes and affirmative action to help out 'the downtrodden' who did well enough under communism to become one of the Chinese diaspora elite. They can go live under the communisim their forefathers gave them, or they can get fight in China to get rid of it. The last thing on earth we need to do is follow your idea. Feel free to open Australia's borders to China's diaspora.

Yeah, Right

"Crozier is a captain in the US Navy."

Yes. Still is, is my understanding.

"Do you have any idea of the obligations that come with his rank?"

Very little, to be sure, though I do understand the concept of a Chain of Command. Crozier went outside it, and was then told to STFU. Nothing sinister in that.

The point I make is that Wenliang also went outside his Chain of Command, and was then unceremoniously told to STFU. Again, I fail to see how there is anything sinister in that, however appalled I might be about the heavy-handed nature of his "reprimand".

"He is not an employee of the Navy."

That I did not know.

"People do not die for their obligations to General Motors or any other crappy company."

I have not asked Crozier to fall on his sword.
I did not ask Wenliang to fall victim to Covid-19.

I said what I said, and what I said is this: if anyone in any organization talks about something they are not authorized to talk about then they should expect to be told to STFU, and especially-so if the people above him are already in official negotiations with others.

After all, it is the organ-grinder who is in charge, not the chattering monkey.


I think we should be reminded of a little fact about the China Commnunist goverment structure. The local government at Wuhan has a lot of autonomous authority, they don't have to report to the central government what they do everyday. Until words get out that something they did might affect the reputation of the CCP. This is the reason there is a sytemic corruption in their governement.

In China communist system of government, you'd bet it is a given that problems/issues will be burried at the local government level. They would not want to show their incompetence in making it a national issue (it is extremely damaging to their career, or sometime fatal).

In my oppinion. There was apparently a cover up at local level. Up until Dr Li Wenliang blew the whistle on Dec 30, it was still in the local government hands whether to get the CCP involved.

Of course we don't know if they already starting to elevate the issue before Dec 30. There are CCP informants at all local governments, so that would make it hard for them to hide something as important as this.

Corruption and incompetence could explain the delay.

jim ticehurst

Colonel....This whole Bloody Matter Stinks..like the Bodys being burned in the Chinese Crematoriums..Screams and All...To Clean up this Mess...Those who Attack you for your concerns and Suspicions...are TOO Ignorant and Lazy to Research Real Data..and Instead of Finding Deep Es Tut Mir Leids and Remorse.. for being responsible for Causing so much Pain and Suffering...The CCP apparently sees an Opportunity to gaing Strategic Insighs Political..Economic and Militray..from Letting the Hounds Loose on the World...Only Now...Its back to the Game Room...Big Stack of Platinum Chips...and Discuss Global Buying Opportunitys...Maybe even Possible without the front men...and corrupt Yankees to help set it up...Im Thinking Colonel..Since we are the same Age...Maybe you grew up seeing the same films I did of The CCP...Mao Purges..in the 1950s...Then..The CCP Tied your hands to a pole behind your back..brought you out of a HOOTCH..and shot you in the Head...Perhaps....They should be shown again..


interestingly enough most of the countries surrounding China have weathered the covid 19 quite well. Vietnam has had no deaths.The warnings went out early because they had the intelligence,or were warned by China.
The further you get from Asia the worse it gets.However the biggest winner will be the planet earth who is breathing a little easier.You could almost say that the bats and there viruses are the planets wmd's.So forget the blame game because there is a bigger predator in town.

Oil is poison,plain and simple.


blue peacock

Excellent thinking. Let us see what others on this thread think would be effective elements of a covert action plan against the CCP.


yeah, right

Your actual or feigned ignorance of the military ethos is so profound that it just is not worth my while to try to explain it to you.

Yeah, Right

I’m sorry Fred, but I’m sticking to my guns on this because I happen to be right.

YOU claimed that this doctor was arrested.
YOU have now linked to three articles that all report that he was not arrested, he was reprimanded.

YOU claimed that he was forced to recant.
YOU have now linked to three articles that all show that was was not forced to recant, he was told to STFU.

My characterisation of those articles is quite correct. Yours.... not so much...

His treatment was heavy-handed, the Chinese admit that.
The police who handed out that treatment acted inappropriately, the Chinese admit that.

But he was not arrested. He was not told to recant.
Will you admit that, or will you continue to dig yourself into a hole?


Yeah Right,

The original article did not support my statement, gotcha! All other common knowledge at the time wrong! Gotha, yeah right wins again. China good!
No, I won't admit "china did not arrest him", but only to irritate a verbatimist like yourself.
"His treatment was heavy-handed, the Chinese admit that." Yes, I admit China's heavy handed treatment killed him. Thanks for letting us all know that "heavy handed" does not mean "arrested" in China. It's a distinction without differnece, except to appologists for communist China.



" would also add the prevention of any US funds (pension, PE, hedge funds) from investing in Chinese companies and not allowing their listing on US exchanges."

Good ideas. Yves Smith has had a running commentary on the mismanagement of CAPERS and it's current Chief Investment Officer, Ben Meng. He lost them a billion dollars by removing risk insurance at the time of highest risk. The mismanagement is defininetly worth a congressional investigation (Won't happen under Pelosi). Trump should have multiple federal agencies looking into what is happening there that might be against the law.

We should also restrict all immigrant visas from Communist China and either revoke or refuse to renew any currently in place. These visa recipients are not the 'poor downtrodden' of communist China, they are the sons and daughters of the elite and upper middle classes. They are the backbone of the one party state, the beneficiaries of its largess and the source of its future leaders. The communist government does not let the disloyal go abroad to gain higher education and lucrative employment or business opportunties. Millions of Americans out of work; for any company to say they can't find skilled work the proper response is "raise wages" until you do.


Seeing you arguing about the Chinese and Capt. Crozier, just recalled what heard over there.. from a Russian "doctor on conceptual intelligence"...

"Asian interpretation of an ethical society:

-Number one: honor, and unwavering priciple.

-Number two: honor force you to live in a true way; truth is the sword of the soul, where there is no honor, there is no spirit, and there are no acts of conscious heroism that defeat the enemy.

-Number three: channelling the truth is called justice; the spirit of justice demands honest behavior.

-Number four: justice leads us to harmony of the world; harmony is the proportionality of non-equal parts.

-Number five: harmony eliminates the struggle of opposites and gives peace to the soul.

-Number six: with peace in the sould happiness is born.

-Number seven: Love is born with the happiness of the soul and spirit.

-Number eight: the truth takes root in love, the truth only becomes visible to those who seek it.

-Number nine: the ability to distinguish the absolute truth is called wisdom, and wisdom is the understanding of the supreme law of good an evil.

-Number ten: wisdom opens the possibility of prophesying the future via revelations; revelations are messages of God and the desire of heaven, the order of things with its cosmic starting point".


"The bottom line is explosive: the Trump administration as well as the CDC had an advance warning of no less than four months – from November to March – to be properly prepared for Covid-19 hitting the U.S. Moreover, the Israeli disclosure supports what’s nothing less than extraordinary: U.S. intel already knew about Sars-Cov-2 roughly one month before the first confirmed cases detected by doctors in a Wuhan hospital. Talk about divine intervention."


Yeah Right,

You think doctors and other professionals in Australia have a “chain of command?” like China and that’s OK? Going outside the chain of command by speaking their mind to the media? A police “reprimand “ in China is not a life threatening event? What planet are you from?



I thought the same as you about the timeline until I did more research. Chinese companies were sequencing the virus mid December and were pretty sure it was like SARS. This knowledge was suppressed. Human to human transmission was only “discovered” officially about 14 January, a month after China already knew.

I had another bit of information last night - the Singaporeans also think China is lying.



Not at the expense of American jobs. I am talking about a long term program to “turn” the best of them. We did that with the USSR I think. Being beastly to guests merely confirms to the Chinese people that we are uncultured savages.

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