31 March 2020


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Mark K Logan


I viewed this thread as a grading of his mannerisms.

I don't view him as a counter-revolutionary. IMO nearly everything he does fits the model of him primarily being concerned with himself. IMO he ran for President to raise his public profile, and his type A obsessive competitiveness kept him in it. His ideology is himself. IOW: I don't see the revolution. He brought in the neo-cons to run his foreign policy. He handed Jerusalem to Israel. He had some notions of bringing manufacturing back but IMO his actions on the matter are half-baked and infrequent, and I don't even blame him overmuch for that. Took decades to ship our mfg. overseas. It will take a generation to move a significant part of it back. IMO the free-traders have set us on a course that there is no easy fixing.

On the fixing: There are some folks I pray do not take my side in a dispute. Trump is one. Is he countering something I am missing?

Yet I don't hate him for that. I pity him if anything. I am more moved towards pity for the utterly self absorbed these days. IMO he has no real friends. I view the self-absorbed as creatures living in a hall of mirrors, and distorted ones. The resultant incuriousity makes them miss so much. I'm glad to see he's not melting down in this crisis, actually.

Rene Laclerk

Walrus and the rest of y'all had me going there...until I looked at the date. Well done.


Mark A Logan

You want a boy scout or someone not from NY City.



Which aircraft carrier? One is at Guam.



There are no PPEs available to Drs and Nurses across the country. It is not that they have them and they are defective. They don't have enough and Drs and Nurses are using and reusing the same masks that is if they find them. That is why all elective surgeries have been cancelled.. to shift resources into ERs and ICUs.

Where is the government’s emergency stockpile of respirator masks, gloves and other medical supplies ? are we are not prepared for a biological war or a catastrophic event?

We had weeks if not months to prepare..

The political system is broken, Democrats blaming Russia and the Republicans blaming China.

But we saw this train crashing into the station in slow motion while we did nothing to prepare.

Even if China was deceitful and hid information. They came clean in late December and locked down the county in January... If it weren't serious why would they have done that? They didn't hind the lock down and the building of 10 new hospitals in Wuhan alone..

We all saw that and did what? Nothing!

Japan, South Korea, and Singapore acted quickly... We were like a deer in the headlight, Dems and GOP playing politics


The carrier with the 100+ infected sailor problem is the USS Theodore Roosevelt currently pierside in Guam. They are faced with trying to find somewhere for the 5000 crew to be disembarked to as they disinfect the ship, a horrendous task. She left port in the US on the 17th Jan, so its either been onboard since then or the virus was inadvertently airlifted in.

I read somewhere but, it seems to have faded, that the US carrier in Japan has a similar but much smaller problem.

It is unlikely that we will get more information as someone woke up to the OPSEC implications and no more updates will be made available on any US military location.

This is not of course limited to US ships, at least 3 submarines, including a Russian, have the problem.


Small update to my last post. Secretary Esper has said today the "it is not the time to evacuate the USS Roosevelt". Whilst very logical from his position this does not seem to have gone down well on social media and probably not on board either as they wait for their turn to head for the sick bay.

This is a really nasty virus in an unfortunate location. You have to feel for the crew.



The standard process on equipment returned due to claims of defects is to quarantine it, inspect items for defects, return the good items back into the system for use/sale and rework or scrap the remainder. If these are basic face masks they probably can't be reworked so if defective they should get scrapped. As to this being central government policy? I doubt it at this time. Some corrupt warehouse manager, factory manager or scrap company dealer putting this stuff on the market? Well, a sucker is born every minute and some corrupt people think they'll get away with it this time.



"There are no PPEs available to Drs and Nurses across the country. "
None, in any hospital? Wow! Where'd you get that propaganda from and why are you repeating it here?
"That is why all elective surgeries have been cancelled"
You mean they didn't get cancelled due to the risk of infection with Covid19 to the patient? What are all the doctors of specialties like Urology doing now, running ventilators, just curious?
"Even if China was deceitful and hid information. They came clean in late December"
Sure thing Comrade! We won't be declaring war tomorrow, we've got a democratic congress.


The USS Roosevelt also made a 'liberty call' in Danang. At today's (4/1) Covid news conference the President made a point of correcting the CNO by stating the USN isn't going to be making overseas port stops any time soon.

There is another point in the defense press:

"No one knows how the coronavirus got onto the ship. Modly said all sailors returning from an early-March port visit in Danang, Vietnam, were tested and found negative for the virus. The first two sailors to develop COVID symptoms did so 14 days after the ship left Danang, he said."

Why lookie there, they didn't show positive after returning from liberty but 14 days later? My, what is "incubation period"? We've got more admirals that carriers, I suggest again that we shitcan a few.The same with carrier captains. Especially after seeing that the CNO didn't bother to inform the Navy or Defense Secretary of what they decided to do in Guam so he would come off look like an ass.

Upstate NY'er

You nailed it.
Government - politicians and bureaucrats - means NO accountability, no responsibility.
9/11, Iraq WMD, billion dollar cost overruns for defense systems that don't work, endless wars and on and on.
Did anyone lose their job or pension?
Of course not.


The only person who, if he had been elected president, would have prepared the country for this health crisis is Bill Gates. And the mac people wouldn't have voted for him.
Oregon didn't stock pile close to enough, that's for sure, that's for dang sure.

On the bright side, the doctor at a veteran's home gave the hq/az cocktail to those infected and a 104 year old man survived and is well enough to celebrate his birthday today.

On the dark side, a friend's daughter depends on hydrochloroquin for a rare disease she has. The pharmacy notified her they can't refill her prescription and she needs to stretch out what she has, taking a pill every other day instead of daily. Hopefully they can ramp up production enough
to supply those who depend on it first and have enough for symptomatic cases.

The Beaver


Here s the proof:

“This was a total mess,” Kushner told people when he got involved last month. “I know how to make this government run now,” he said, according to a source.

“I have all this data about ICU capacity. I’m doing my own projections, and I’ve gotten a lot smarter about this. New York doesn’t need all the ventilators,” Kushner said, according to a person present. During an interview on Hannity on March 26, Trump said: “I don’t believe you need 40,000 or 30,000 ventilators.”

Next he will run the whole West Wing !



"The impression I get is that most heeded the initial WHO advice and thought this would be no big deal."
I have been following WHO output since the beginning and do not recall them ever saying anything like that. They have been very cautious in their statements and have been warning every country to get ready from the moment Wuhan cases started climbing. Their message has been test, contact trace and isolate for months.

Air craft carriers will have the same or worse problems than the Diamond Princess if the crew are not separated ashore. It is very difficult to deal with that level of population density in a confined space.

Somebody here posted the comment they thought it was great that longshoremen would not unload a ship from China. There have been some insane comments in these threads but this must be a contender for worst comment. We have major supply chain issues developing I do not know what was in that ship but if it included PPE they may be responsible for killing their citizens. If you want to pick a ship not to unload due to COVID fears try Italian, Spanish, UK or US. China is about the safest place on the planet to visit at the moment although they will lock up if you do get in because you will have come from a high risk area, relative to them. China is the manufacturing hub for everything we need at the moment if we continue to slander them they may just decide to keep domestic production for themselves until this is over. They would come out of this much stronger than we would. Fortunately they are much better world citizens than most of us.

Christian J Chuba

I do not have a problem w/Trump's leadership on this except for his mindless escalation w/Venezuela, the people around him underestimate the risk of a shooting war.

I have a problem w/our anonymous Intel sources whose only purpose is to make us feel good about ourselves rather than warn us about real threats. They are worse than useless.

The latest red meat subject, 'China is lying about their numbers', why does this matter? Over 5,000 of us are dead with that number increasing by the hour. Let's suppose China has a higher death toll, I guess that means we win.

The total number of deaths in Russia, Japan, and S.Korea is less than 200

So while we are playing the victim, other countries were able to respond effectively and we aren't even questioning ourselves. We are reducing it to, 'they lied'. CNN is daring Trump to choose China over our Intel while FOX is waving the flag. I see us as totally dysfunctional. It's fine for the public to wave the flag but the MSM is supposed to ask questions, not fawn over our bureaucracy.

Here is a list of situation reports from WHO:
The interesting ones are the first 4 starting on 1/21. They are concise. They list the # of infections, where they are and what measures each country is taking. Each one is just a few pages.

S.Korea started screening, quarantine measures and monitoring all pneumonia cases on on 1/3, Japan started doing the same thing on on 1/7. Later they added contact tracing, I don't think we ever got to do that. I wish we had their Intel guys.

Santa Clara started their lock down just one week earlier than NY and they have 200 deaths vs NY's 2,000. An ounce of prevention ...


The Beaver,

"according to a person present. " who told it to, of all people, Gabrial Sherman of Vanity Fair, which publish an article entitled "The Campaign Panicked...." Was there really a national debate about Trump saying he wanted Americans to be able to attend church on Easter because we had beaten this virus? I thought that gave some hope and only the press was bitching about Christians going to church.

Oh, wait, it was published on April 1st. Ha, ha, ha. Good job Gabriel!



I only pretend to be a constitutional scholar but I question whether or not POTUS has the authority to declare a national lock down. Tell me if he has. I would think that this is a state matter unless civil government breaks down at the state level. In that case the president could declare martial law in a particular state and simply take control of the state for direct administration. We do not do that very often and in each case the responsible military authority, in this case the CinC, is legally responsible for his/her actions in the emergency. The blond woman sitting behind John Roberts yesterday at the presser did not seem to understand the limits of presidential power.



That's my read on the president's power also.



I went through every level of officer service school from the infantry Lt. course to the Army War College and the Industrial College of the Armed Forces and was taught all that about martial law at every level.


Who did not warn the President indeed! Dr Chris Martensen from his YouTube channel was warning his listeners that this had all the markings of a global pandemic -- in January -- hair on fire warnings. How is it that he with his $105 internet service could know this when our intelligence community would not know this? Well, that dog don't hunt!



I have a large affection for Trump. We got off easy this time. Now we will be up and running for the Big One, at least.

It is beyond bizarre Pelosi is starting a witch hunt around this, and the press is an ass.

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