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26 September 2019

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turcopolier

All
I agree with all that but IMO the Democrats will impeach Trump if they have the votes no matter what the truth or falseness of the charges will be. They are now launched on a lemming like assault on his presidency that is led by the marxists among them for the purpose of halting the heartfelt counter-revolution of the Deplorables. a movement that he may well not deserve to lead.

Mathias Alexander

The dems have agreed to loose the next election. What marxists?

PRC90

This mess will also have the effect of taking (the now strangely silent) Biden off the 2020 board on the grounds of credibility or even criminality.
Sanders and Warren will then, prematurely, have to move up the board one place and move further into the spotlight.
That will suit Trump very well, and indirectly, Gabbard. If this is part of some DNC strategic plan then it's not well thought out for this reason alone.

Barbara Ann

I note that the IGIC ICWPA "Urgent Concern" report form (link below) includes the following on page 2:

I know about the information I am disclosing here and:
[] I have direct and personal knowledge
[] I heard about it from others
I also note at the bottom of the form that the last revision date was August this year. Just before 12th August perhaps? Now that second tick box choice looks rather out of place on a whistleblower form to me. I'd be interested in seeing the previous version of the form and finding out who revised it.

https://www.dni.gov/files/ICIG/Documents/Hotline/Urgent%20Concern%20Disclosure%20Form.pdf

Donkeyoatey

It appears that this is a political act to enable the steady erosion of the administrations' ability to govern effectively for as long as the circus is in town. The gamble is, among others, that the steady drumbeat of the parade of hearings, inquiries and misstatements of fact continuing through the campaign season will:
A) Result in an actual conviction. (unlikely)
B) Result in a Democratic controlled Senate, House and/or Presidency (moot point)
3) Insurance policy- gain control the Senate after 2020, so that the impeachment test is judged under new leadership. (They probably believe this)
Rules of evidence? Due process? Cross examination? What a strange idea.

As far as his leadership of the movement/counterrevolution? Maybe he's just the catalyst-the precursor. But he saw the zeitgeist and picked up the ball and ran with it. isn't that what demagogues do?


indus56

Not clear that this is incompetence on the complainant's part or the IG's, or the media's for that matter. While incompetence aplenty is in evidence, that evidence speaks to how clumsily they do it, rather than to why they have reached the decision to participate in this. That said, this should be sufficient evidence to warrant the IG's suspension, and investigation by an IG for the IG's office. We shouldn't be holding our breath.

Bill H

Central to the charges made by Democrats is that Trump was "pressuring" Zelensky to investigate Biden. The fact is that there is absolutely no need to investigate Biden. The story he has told out of his own mouth is sufficient in itself. You don't need to know anything about the Ukranian prosecutor or what he was doing. You don't need to know anything about Biden's son or the son's business dealings. You just have to listen to Biden himself tell the story.

Two facts are plain in the story as Biden tells it. That he coerced compliance as to Ukraine's internal governance, and that he used $1 billion of US foreign aid money as an instrument of extortion in order to do it. He himself says so.

President Trump says in that phone call that, "What Joe Biden did was shameful," a statement with which I cannot help but agree. The media's comment in their followup was a stunning, "There is no evidence that Joe Biden did anything wrong."

Terry

I am really getting sick of these coup attempts. The Democrats must feel they have no chance at the ballot box and that a majority of Americans will accept a coup. I don't think the propaganda is working as well as they think it is. I'm not a fan of Trump overall except for a couple of his policies but I am a fan of our Republic.

Have we really reached the stage where an American Praetorian guard picks our President and the ballot box and electoral college become Imperial window dressing?

I'm a left leaning Independent but I hope that the Democrats get a tremendous whipping at the ballot box in 2020. I plan to do my small part in that.

Terence Gore

https://kunstler.com/clusterfuck-nation/a-dumpster-fire-on-a-garbage-barge/

"UkraineGate, son of RussiaGate..."

turcopolier

mathias alexander

Sanders, Warren, the Squad, Swalwell, etc.

Jackrabbit

Another attack by the Houthi's - or any attack that can be pinned on Iran - could mean war.

Suddenly, a bogus complaint surfaces - from a CIA source(!) - that turns public debate into a partisan wasteland of charge and counter-charge.

We are not supposed to take notice of this. We are not supposed to apply any thought. We are just supposed to be entertained by the kayfabe.

h

Rep Al Green and Pelosi are on the record stating impeachment of Trump is the only way to beat him in 2020. So, yes, the 'marxists' campaign to impeach the President is in full swing. It has been since the day he won. Oh well...

That said, hardcore radical Left partisans are all in but the moderates and blue dogs are moving to Independent in droves, as they have been since at least 2008. Due to so many moving pieces the strategy at play, as I see it, is to box in the 'marxists' although I'd add the neolibs/cons, by stamping their foreheads in bright red/Not American.

Any who have bothered themselves to keep up with the nonsensical, absurd, counter-productive policy making coming out of DC over the last couple of decades knows/senses a black glove guiding said events. Congress remains their devoted partner in this usurpation. For heavens sake, one only needs to look at their bank accounts to understand many have kissed the ring and benefited greatly. Add to their financial largess the fact most of them should have retired long ago but appear steadfast in their determination to remain until their last breath. One only does that if there is some sort of payoff in the end.

But I digress. What I see happening is the outing of that black glove, the uprooting of those tentacles and a stake slowly being driven through the heart of their dastardly usurpation. Those who practice these dark arts succeeded over decades of quietly and patiently infiltrating every institution in the U.S. and by publicly outing their dark deeds, such as this latest attempt to smear the President, the public is ever so slowly awakening to their game. They are finally beginning to ask questions, whereas in the not so distant past, they ignored it all.

As Larry suggests, these useful idiots weren't expecting Trump to release the phone transcript let alone the RumorBlower's report to the public. All one needs to do is a simple comparison and contrast to discern where the truth lies. Americans nor the world's citizens are stupid.

President Trump and his team are doing a masterful job in corralling these usurpers into a corner, giving them plenty of rope and will continue to choke off avenues they once took for granted would always be open to them.

I look forward to Trump's next move...

Diana C

I have no comment to this latest "production" of the Democratic Party. That is because Adam Schiff pushed it out of the political and into the dramatic with his rendition (he called it a parody) of a Mob Boss.

Jean Paul Sartre is enjoying this wherever he may be. We are now truly living in the realm of the absurd and there seems to be "no exit."

Barbara Ann

Seems I'm not the only one to have noticed this (thread).

https://twitter.com/ClimateAudit/status/1177580473566093312

As of now the IGIC hotline page, where the above report form is now linked, has a broken link at the bottom called "Submit a form online". This points to a (missing) Word document at the following address: https://www.dni.gov/files/ICIG/Documents/Hotline/ICIG%20Hotline%20Form.docx

Why have 2 links, is this the old form? Maybe someone here can confirm what the pre August 2019 report form looked like. If the IGIC get caught gerrymandering their website and reporting processes to cover up this latest attempt to get at Trump we'll should see some real fireworks.

LA Sox Fan

I have been an attorney for over 20-years. So when I first read of the alleged whistleblower complaint, I immediately looked at the statute allowing such complaints, 50 USC sec. 3033. Read it for yourself if interested.

While I have no opinion on whether or not a complaint could be based on hearsay, I can say that this “intelligence activity whistleblower” complaint is completely improper and should have been rejected by the IG.

Any unbiased reading of the statute shows that the whistleblowing must concern either a person or activity that is under the authority of the Director of National Intelligence. One cannot use this statute to whistleblow to the Inspector General of the Intelligence Community, a subordinate official of the DNI, on anything that the DNI has no authority over.

Simply put, there is nothing in the statute that allows an “intelligence activity whistleblower” complaint to be made concerning the president or his phone calls. Such matters are not supervised by the DNI and are outside the jurisdiction of this statute.

Same as a “whistleblower” complaint that the US Postal Service is slow delivering my mail or that there is no toilet tissue in the Yellowstone National Park men’s room is not an activity supervised supervised by the DNI and is not the proper subject of an “intelligence activity whistleblower” complaint, for these same reasons a complaint about the president or his phone calls is also not the proper subject of such a complaint. This complaint should have been rejected by an honest and competent IG.

Taking off my lawyer hat, my personal opinion is that this improper whistleblower complaint was crafted by one or more NatSec employees, in coordination with allies in Congress, for the sole purpose of starting impeachment proceedings. I look at this as nothing less that NatSec coup attempt.

semiconscious

wow! very good catch...

why would an urgent concern form allow for the submission of hearsay as testimony?...

The Twisted Genius

Bill H, Joe Biden served as the point man for the Obama administration’s effort to root out some of the corruption rampant in the Ukrainian government. The IMF and EU were also pushing this. This was probably the only non-shameful aspect of our terribly misguided and implemented policies concerning Ukraine. I’m still convinced one of the ultimate goals of that fiasco was to make Sevastopol into a NATO naval base. Screwed the pooch on that one, didn’t we?

Biden boasted of bullying the Poroshenko government into getting rid of chief prosecutor Victor Shokin, a notoriously corrupt individual who refused to investigate corruption by oligarchs and government officials. Shokin stymied any investigation into Mykola Zlochevsky and Burisma. His stonewalling led to a Britsh fraud and money laundering case against Zlochevsky and Burisma to fall apart. In my opinion Zlochevsky hired Hunter Biden in an effort to protect himself from US efforts to root out corruption. This didn’t help Zlochevsky or Shokin. The US and Biden still pushed for the firing of Shokin and the investigation of Zlochevsky and Burisma in spite of Hunter's position at Burisma.

The Trump-Guliani effort to paint the story as Joe Biden shielding his son from prosecution is a pure fabrication. Biden was part of the whole ugly Ukraine mess orchestrated by the Nuland-Clinton crowd at DOS and fully supported by Obama, but Biden’s part in the firing of Shokin was a rare bright spot in that mess. Hunter Biden's accepting the position and money from Burisma is an embarrassment, but far from a crime.

The Beaver

Mr Johnson

You wrote this:
He was not party to the phone conversation and did not have access to the transcript.

and yet on page #3 the WB wrote this:

. I was not the only non-White House official to receive readout of the call. Based on my understanding, multiple State Dept and IC officials were also briefed on their contents of the call ...( abbreviated for easy typing )

Am I missing something since POTUS keeps mentioning second hand info whilst it looks like the WB did have a readout?


Larry Johnson

"Read out" is second hand info. Being told something without having heard the conversation or read the actual transcript is know as HEARSAY. got it?

Old_it_guy

If the matter is as serious as alleged..then how can one take anything said by Mr. Schiff seriously when he jokes about the whole conversation , according to his own words ,after the spectacle he made.

Has he mental illness or just no impulse control?

artemesia

Agree.

Well done, and thank you to Barbara Ann and to all those, like Col. Lang, who put their time and talent to creating & maintaining sites like this that are civic virtue in action.

Factotum

Voters need to stop electing Democrats. As long as they do, we remain mired in our noble experiment of representative government.

What makes Democrats still win elections? That is the question we need to address. When did we become servants of our government; rather than the other way around. That historical path needs more attention.

Could it have started when JFK unionized government employees and allowed government employee union members, fronted by the Democrat Party, to ensure who would sit on both sides of the lucrative public bargaining table?

Factotum

I suspect Gabbard is being held in reserve for the VP slot, since the top slot contenders are all crazy and will need some balance on the ticket.

Is Gabbard that craven she will allow her political future go into free fall, hooking her wagon to any of the doomed to fail Democrat candidates. She cannot win 2020 on her own - she needs the Democrat machine behind her. But she has earned no points to be leading it. Yet.

John Merryman.

I'm starting to see Trump as the Joker incarnate. Any sane effort to take down the deep state would have been quickly quashed, but he has them all shooting themselves in the foot.

Factotum

Trump already made his next move- appointing Scalia as Secy of Labor - that is where the deep swamp action is really going on - the big public sector unions who are screaming bloody murder about this appointment.

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