The right to own and bear arms ...

Government has structure.  That is in the essence of government.  That structure is expressed in constitutions and laws.  Without that structure society would collapse in anarchy with the strongest and most rapacious ruling by terror and force.  Alternatively, a government that possesses a monopoly of the means of coercion and a point of view like that of socialism or fascism that demands compliance with its program will inevitably become a tyranny.

To that end the framers and founders of the US wrote a constitution that is the supreme law of the land and that is impossible to change without the compliance of the states as the sovereign entity partners in that constitution.

Bearing on the present hysteria over Gilroy, El Paso and Dayton: 

1.  The 2nd amendment to the US Constitution guarantees to the citizens of the US the right to keep and bear arms.

2.  In the United States vs The District of Columbia in 2008, SCOTUS ruled that the right to bear arms in self defense and defense of the home is an INDIVIDUAL right, not a right that can only be exercised as part of a state government associated militia.  In this decision the door was left open for governments to deny the right to ownership to the mentally ill as well as to prior felons.

3.  In Federalist Paper 46 James Madison writing as "Publius" in favor of the ratification of the present constitution argues that the proposed federal government could not become a tyranny precisely because it would be denied a monopoly of the means of coercion by the existence of state militias and the "unorganized militia" of the whole body of the armed citizenry.  Those who think that a people armed with light weapons and improvised mines is not a major factor in internal struggles for power have learned nothing from the history of the last hundred years.

As a practical matter, it is impossible to disarm the American People.  ATF estimates that there are over 270 MILLION firearms in private hands.  "From my cold dead hands"  was the cry of Charlton Heston describing the moment when government could take his guns.

The cry of the Left for "universal" background checks is once more abroad.  Do not be deceived.  "Universal" would mean ALL transfers firearms between Americans.

The various governments should get busy and find the means of denying firearms to the mentally ill.  pl

Comments

[Mightypeon]

I am on two minds about this.

On one hand, I can certainly appreciate that a state which is somewhat afraid of its citizenry will not overreach as much. On the other hand, a state that is afraid of its citizenry may actually end up far more violent towards it.

US state violence against American citizens, meaning not just police shootings and other violence (I showed some videos of police violence to some Russian cops whom I happen to be related too. Reactions were interesting to say the least. Especially concerning civil asset forfeiture which they regarded as a surefire way to turn a normal police unit into a bunch of corrupt predatory highwaymen.).
but also things like civil asset forfeiture, removal of due process via plea bargain abuse etc.

However, assuming that the US state would suddenly become more bening in its interactions with the citenzry if the citizenry would unilaterally disarm seems like a suckers bet to me.

[Vegetius]

In the last three years we have seen a failed plot by government agents to overturn a lawful election, as well as the inability and/or unwillingness of that same government to perform the most basic functions of border security.

Now we hear anti-white voices on the political left employing exterminatory rhetoric with regard to the native white population of this republic. And on the so-called right, we see a President and party leaders so unprincipled that they push for laws similar to those which politicized psychiatry and pathologized dissent in the late Soviet Union.

Anyone calling for restrictions on the ability of the sovereign people to defend themselves at this time is, at best, misguided. At worst, they are traitors.

[Patrick Armstrong]

Ban multi-bladed assault knives.
https://www.bbc.com/news/uk-48186035

[Eric Newhill]

Sir,
Yes we must keep the 2A in the broadest terms, but we must deny the mentally ill access.

We know who's mentally ill. I can see the diagnoses, hospitalizations, prescriptions, etc of anyone who's ever had such healthcare services paid for by any insurance company (+ govt programs). This is the same database, more or less, that allows us to know if someone had a pre-existing condition. It shouldn't be a big deal to link the inter-insurance cooperative database to the firearm purchasing background database. Data could be inputted from other sources as well.

I also think that level headed non-partisan clinicians could work out criteria that does a good job of being fair and just. Logic could be developed such that someone diagnosed with, say, brief reactive anxiety - a temporary acute condition - would not be excluded from gun ownership after being clear for a few months. Same with veterans coming home with PTSD. I think that building logic identifying those with chronic serious conditions or reoccurring acute serious conditions could be done fairly easily (we do that kind of algorithm development as SOP). There could be a clinical appeals process for anyone who thinks they've been unreasonably denied the ability to purchase. I don't see any of that as being prohibitively costly.

The real hurdle is getting these young males identified and into the database in the first place. It must be made easier to have people fitting the profile committed to treatment and into the system. The Florida school shooter and the Dayton guy were clearly a danger to others due to mental health issues. Why they were allowed back in school and why they were not under the supervision of mental health experts escapes me entirely.

I know, funding tied to school graduate rates, liberal notions of rights for the mentally ill play a role, but are we serious about preventing violence or not?

We also, to get this ball rolling, have to agree that taking guns won't solve the problem. A guy in Japan committed arson last week and deliberately killed 35 people (gasoline and matches). We know that some mass killers have used motor vehicles. Someone will get the idea of poisoning the produce at the grocery store or bring a big sword to class. We need to focus on the man, not the method.

[turcopolier]

mightypeon

You are merely waiting to find the right government ass to kiss.

[walrus]

Eric, the rate of false positive diagnoses is going to be way too high to make this work. The left will brand masculinity a mental condition. A single teenage outburst will get you banned for life.

[J]

The shooting in Texas could have been minimized had their been one watching the Bose Facial Recognition camera system that is in all of that particular box store chain nationwide. The same Bose Facial Recognition camera system that is tied to Homeland Security. If somebody had been watching that live video feed, they could have immediately sounded the alarm before the individual was completely inside the store and before he started walking up and down the aisles firing. In addition if they had had paid armed off-duty commissioned law enforcement at the entrances it would have helped to minimize as well.

[catherine]

''The Florida school shooter and the Dayton guy were clearly a danger to others due to mental health issues. Why they were allowed back in school and why they were not under the supervision of mental health experts escapes me entirely. ''

WHERE were the parents in all this? They had to know something was wrong.

[Lars]

I don't think the second amendment was meant to be a suicide pact. There is a compelling reason to curtail some gun ownership and numerous mass killings demand it. I still think that a comprehensive and universal licensing system would work the best. You can still own guns, but you have to prove that you should. The Heller decision would not prohibit this either.

As I have said before, there is a tipping point out there and when it is reached, the public will demand something that may be rather draconian and political careers will rely on delivering. Those resisting reasonable controls will only have themselves to blame, should it happen.

[Max B]

Newhill:
"We know who's mentally ill." Do "we"? Who sets that standard? Who writes the DSM? Has that entity made any conspicuously audacious decisions in the past few years? Has that entity ruled that 'a person who wants to remove their external genitals and have a section of their digestive tract rewired to a surgically-implanted hole' is natural and normal, but stoicism is a mental defect?

APA on Transsexuals
https://www.apa.org/topics/lgbt/transgender.pdf

APA on Toxic Masculinity
https://www.apa.org/monitor/2019/01/ce-corner
"The main thrust of the subsequent research is that traditional masculinity—marked by stoicism, competitiveness, dominance and aggression—is, on the whole, harmful."

Newhill:
"I also think that level headed non-partisan clinicians could work out criteria that does a good job of being fair and just."

Political actors, by definition, are neither level-headed nor non-partisan.

[Jack]

Sir

My grandpa while just a farmer and rancher was one of the more erudite men I have known. He always stressed that what made the United States unique was the fact that it is a constitutional republic. He made it known to me when I was a young boy that the amendments that constitute the Bill of Rights should be interpreted broadly as the intent of the constitution was to protect the citizenry from the tyranny of government. In his opinion the framers recognized that all governments would tend towards tyranny. I fully concur with him, and in the twilight of my life I’m dismayed how far we have strayed from the wisdom of the earlier generations. Any chipping away at the rights in those amendments would inevitably lead to them becoming effectively voided. One of my peeves is how we have chipped away at the 4th and 5th amendments all under the guise of safety. Another is the point you have made consistently, that we are a union of states which is further under pressure most recently in the hysteria over the electoral college.

One of the challenges of mass immigration particularly from societies where there is no established skepticism of governmental power is erosion in the ethos of what made the US unique. IMO, we have done a very poor job in assimilating the millions who have come in the recent decades. If our constitutional republic should survive we need to be better in educating not only our children but those who come here from other places. Many don’t have grandpa’s like I was fortunate to have.

[Serge]

Slippery slope these databases. I don’t think the problem is big enough to warrant this risk. Level headed non partisan climicians are rarer than you think, and are always prone to be coopted anyhow. Think the opiate crisis.I dont even think these people including the two you mentioned are mentally ill,no more than jihadis are mentally ill. This solution of more control and categorization comes off as very unamerican to me.

[walrus]

I have problems with the “mental health” criterion. It is too easy to construct a “catch 22” situation where a request to purchase a military - like weapon or anything for self defence is regarded as incipient paranoia, thereby disqualifying.

[The Twisted Genius]

The big difference I see in all these knife assaults is that there is one victim at a time, often with multiple assailants. Edged weapons are certainly less lethal than semiautomatic rifles with 100 round magazines. It is also a distinctly different sensation killing someone with an edged weapon than with a firearm.

[The Twisted Genius]

Eric, I agree with this approach, but it will be fraught with at least as much controversy as any firearms limiting legislation if not more.

[Artemesia]

USA models many of its programs on Israel.

Here's what a popular Israeli rabbi thinks of each Jewish Israeli's right to defend "the Jewish people and the Jewish homeland, by whatever means . . ."

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tMckgMvy_kA

Machiavelli wrote in The Prince that Moses was the leader most worthy of being emulated because he consulted directly with god. Rabbi David bar-Hayim bases his teachings on the Books of Moses, Torah.

[Artemesia]

"We know who's mentally ill."

Compared to what?

The situations people live in can make them "mentally ill," even to the point of acting out criminally.

Blacks more-or-less forcibly removed from the South in the pre-WWII years and housed in urban, multi-story apartments with no green space, were nearly literally fish out of water: When the human objects of a social engineering project react unfavorably, perhaps the engineering scheme should be consulted before deciding that the human is "mentally ill."

Who gets to diagnose that congressmen, or key decision-makers in government service, are "mentally ill"?
Those persons can do and have done far more damage than all of the "white supremacist" shooters combined: shouldn't they have to certify that they are not mentally ill before being given life-and-death powers?

[turcopolier]

TTG

Have you killed anyone?

[Jim Ticehurst]

Colonel Lang...The writers of The Constitution Knew there would have been No Continental Army if The Colonists had not Had had their Rifles..and True Grit..Tyrrany is Tyrrany...I Have My Dads old Remington Single shot 22 cal Bolt action Rifle..I would take it out to Our local 100 year old Gun Range...Frequently used to train local Military....But a Democrat County Offical shut it Down by applying so Many requirements for New Permits etc It May Never Reopen...

[The Twisted Genius]

Yes

[Sharac]

Mass shootings as unfortunate as they are are minor of the evil that comes when government goes rogue then sooner or later you get organized mass shootings which as history shows are not something fun to experience. Basically next best thing to doing nothing is to arm citizens even more (ccw) and require decent level of proficiency. Assuming you have more than 50% of decent people things would turn better on their own. Assuming less than 50% decent makes any kind of society pointless. In US you would do much better calling spade a spade and focus on legal drug abuse, black ghettos and instead of trying to police the world police yourself and remove bunch of power hungry bastards from buttons with power. Most of what is going on nowadays is by design to divide and conquer, smoke and mirrors so rats can operate out of sight.

[Mightypeon]

Sir, with due respect, this is uncalled for.

[D]

The 2A should be repealed, unless the herrenvolk still believe in the suppression of slave revolts and the genocide of indigenous peoples.

[CK]

Parent not parents. No father present for most of these boys.

[Paco]

Just like war evolved to become hybrid, a hybrid civil war in the USA is raging, and it is not front page news anymore , it has become a usual occurrence, like the weather report.