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19 March 2018

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catherine


''This is illustrative of a weakening of Israeli/AIPAC/Saudi influence in US Middle East policy. It will be interesting to see if Votel is rebuked for these statements. pl ''


Hooray !!
I am sure the boys at JINSA and the Fifth Column will be furious....let them rage. The more they show themselves the better.

Willybilly

We’re still not out of the woods yet... Most of these statements are mostly disinformation in the fog of readying the troops!

catherine

After an hour of searches have not found a single major media outlet or press has quoted anything Votel said in the hearing about the Iran deal.
Instead they have headlines and coverage/quotes only about Russia's meddling in Syria.

Therefore the public will not know that those like Tillerson, Mattis and JCS Dunford all agree on keeping the Iran deal...they will only read bad Russia.

Charles

By whom of any significance would Votel be rebuked?

turcopolier

charles

By the White House, the president, McMaster, etc. pl

turcopolier

WillyBilly

i didn't say we were "out of the woods" but it is a good start. IMO all these statements by Votel are true and it took a good deal of courage to make them in public. pl

Willybilly

I very much hope you’re right .... and I am totally wrong

different clue

Catherine notes that the MSM has said zero about what Votel, Mattis and Dunford have said or thought about Iran and Syria. Even if our host had not made his confirming statement about Votel's true commitment to his statements, I would have offered the secondary supposition that Votel's commitment to these statements is true.

I would say that because of the MSM silence on them that Catherine has noted. If Votel was making these statements as false-fog noise to hide the movement of men and materiel to use against Iran and Syria, as WillyBilly theorizes, the MSM would be broadcasting and highlighting the false-fog in order to keep the buildup hidden and keep Syria and Iran off guard. The fact that the MSM is so silent makes me think the MSM wants Votel's statements to die in silence under the MSM Cone of Silence. Meaning the MSM and its masters reject these statements but can only hope to starve them of attention because the MSM couldn't prevent Votel from making them.

Richardstevenhack

"then we will have to have another way to deal with their nuclear weapons program," said U.S. Army General Joseph Votel."

Iran does not have and has never had a "nuclear weapons program" with the possible exception of a "feasibility study" back when they were afraid Saddam had one. I believe this was the opinion of the DIA in the run up to the 2007 Iran NIE which did not make it into the NIE. But this is consistent with the publicly available information and Iran's own statements.

Anna

"... these statements by Votel are true and it took a good deal of courage to make them in public."
-- If true they constitute a strong expression of patriotism. God, give us more outspoken patriots.
(This is a paradoxical time in the US when truth and patriotism are not a norm.)

Generalfeldmarschall von Hindenburg

What had been happening and what I expect to see is that, as during the George II Administration, the US would loudly accuse Iran of breaking faith with agreements and demand unlimited access for 'inspectors'. The Iranians know how that cartoon ends, so they'd refuse, unlike Mr Saddam. And then the US would call on the client states in the EU to join them in tightening sanctions. Eventually provocation could be arranged and the US would "have no choice but to respond." - some patrol boats being shot at by Iranians as has happened. We all will recall how Obama was cast as a creampuf appeaseer when 'our boys' were caught zooming around Iranian waters.
Too many powerful actors on the American political stage have determined hat Iran must be collapsed (It was on the famous hit-list after all) for them to let this go.

Jony Kanuck

Colonel,
I too am impressed with the general’s candour, especially with the official commentary starting to sound like it was written by Geo. Orwell.

i wonder how much of the general’s resignation on Syria is driven by acceptance of the situation on the ground. I make US forces as 10k, so at best 5k combatants, w/o armour. There’s air support but it’s up against Russian sa3k & 4k. And if you hit Hizbollah, Hizbollah will hit Israel (they know). This appears a very messy & a doubtful outcome.

I've been trying to figure (not a sailor) the naval angles. Even w/o deployment of Kinzhals, I don’t think the USN can bring a carrier into the eastern Med. Two destroyers firing cruise missiles would go down in :20 minutes after launch. So 6-8 destroyers firing cruise missiles from the Med. & Red Sea. Three hundred missiles might overwhelm Russian air defence but they probably saw this coming, so 50 ship killing missiles are headed for the destroyers. If two or three destroyers go down, it’s something else that doesn’t look like a clean victory.

So, are we back to ‘a balance of terror’?

ChrisFahlman

This testimony is a signal that the military will back, with sound arguments, a decision by Trump to support the JCPOA. That will make Trump's life easier.

wisedupearly Ceo

I suggest that the community get busy and post this information and links to as many comment pages in the MSM pages as possible. Time to fight for the Republic.

Imagine

Iran does not have a nuclear weapons program. Gen. Votel should know better. They have a nuclear energy program, which the media cleverly calls a "nuclear program" because they correctly assess no one will pick up on the deception.
http://www.wideasleepinamerica.com/2016/03/putting-lid-on-clintons-erroneous.html

Iran has disavowed nuclear weapons over a hundred times, documented, count 'em, over the past few decades:
http://www.wideasleepinamerica.com/2012/10/the-goldberg-predilections-ignoring.html

On strategic, tactical, and religious grounds.
Because they don't solve anything, look at how much trouble Israel is having.
"Anyone who talks of nukes is mentally retarded", pretty straightforward.

However, Israelis think that Iran is lying its ass off and secretly building a nuke because of projection: it is just exactly what an Israeli would do if Israelis were Iranians.

And, since America sadly lets Israel drive its strategic decisions, this does not get examined.

The Twisted Genius

I think Votel expressed a sobering account of what CENTCOM can take on in the region. Our forces in eastern Syria are minimal and are dependent on the YPG/SDF for manpower. The Turkish invasion of Afrin is stressing our relationship with the Kurds. If they make moves towards Kobane or elsewhere against the Kurds, we will be presented with a tough choice. I do believe Russia and even Damascus is forcing that choice upon us with the eager help of Turkey. And Votel sees that coming. The last thing he needs is the added challenge of the collapse of the Iran Agreement. He's still saddled with trying to prevent a final consolidation of Syria in support of Israeli objectives while defeating what remains of ISIS. That's more than enough to handle.

catherine

I do not like this. Might as well invite Israel to start more wars as I am certain it would be US blood and treasure spent for the most part.

http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Juniper-Cobra-begins-with-US-and-IDF-troops-simulating-missile-attacks-544598

US Third Air Force Commander Lt. Gen. Richard Clark in Israel for joint drill says:

"We are ready to commit to the defense of Israel anytime we get involved in a kinetic fight there is always the risk that there will be casualties. But we accept that - as every conflict we train for and enter, there is always that possibility,"

''“As far as decision-making, it is a partnership,” he continued, stressing nonetheless that “at the end of the day it is about the protection of Israel – and if there is a question in regards to how we will operate, the last vote will probably go to Zvika [Brig.-Gen. Zvika Haimovitch, head of the IDF's Aerial Defense Division].”


Willybilly

I am still of the opinion that a major war is afoot despite Votel’s statements and others. Russia is doing all it can using all channels available to dissuade them from launching such folly... Its still 50/50 IMO and I would venture to say that war is inevitable with such a crew at 1600

Bill Herschel

The Midterm elections. The Midterm elections. Everything that transpires in Washington is about the Midterm elections. Let us hope that Votel's message is, "The military is not on board for an adventure in the Middle East whose sole purpose is to make the President a "Wartime" President." Now I know that if the President says jump the military must say how high, but somehow I think that Votel's message is, "Congress, sane people, understand that reality is not set up to make Trump a hero in anything except his own mind."

Trump has been thoroughly outmaneuvered in Korea. The grandstand meeting with Kim will not end in war, because that war will be a really unpopular war. Iran is the only possibility. Let's see who's more powerful: Israel and Saudi Arabia, or the American people. Let's see if this really is a democracy. Let's see if we can practice what we preach to the rest of the world. Let's see if we can actually exemplify what we spend $600 billion a year trying to ram down other country's throats.

eakens

How about this clown. Last three paragraphs are quite telling.

http://www.jpost.com/Israel-News/Juniper-Cobra-begins-with-US-and-IDF-troops-simulating-missile-attacks-544598

How can we find Clark's email address so we can perhaps send him a nice note to let him know what real US citizens think.

nard

Someone needs to knock some heads together so all sing from the same page!
US troops should be prepared to die for the Jewish State (US Air Force 3rd AF Commander Lt. Gen. Richard Clark) Jerusalem Post

“As far as decision-making, it is a partnership,” he continued, stressing nonetheless that “at the end of the day it is about the protection of Israel – and if there is a question in regards to how we will operate, the last vote will probably go to Zvika [Brig.-Gen. Zvika Haimovitch, head of the IDF's Aerial Defense Division].”

Washington and Israel have signed an agreement which would see the US come to assist Israel with missile defense in times of war and, according to [Israeli commander] Haimovitch, "I am sure once the order comes we will find here US troops on the ground to be part of our deployment team to defend the State of Israel."

And those US troops who would be deployed to Israel, are prepared to die for the Jewish state, Clark said. "We are ready to commit to the defense of Israel anytime we get involved in a kinetic fight there is always the risk that there will be casualties. But we accept that - as every conflict we train for and enter, there is always that possibility," he said.

William Fitzgerald

TTG,

Did you mean to say, "trying to promote (rather than "prevent") a final consolidation of Syria in support of Israeli objectives"?

WPFIII

Charles

Given the speed with which the president has made his thoughts and rebukes known in the recent past, it would appear that the General is not going to be rebuked in a timely fashion.

kooshy

FYI, it's time to change the oath of enlistment, this the same kind of stupid extremist push that jews have done throughout their history which has repeatedly caused them a blowback.

"TOP US GENERAL SAYS AMERICAN TROOPS SHOULD BE READY TO DIE FOR ISRAEL"

https://southfront.org/top-us-general-says-american-troops-ready-die-israel/

Sid Finster

For an extra funny, at one time, the United States was happy to supply fuel cycle capable breeder reactors to Iran, before the 1979 Revolution intervened.

No less a personage than Dick Cheney, who was President Ford's Chief of Staff at the time, commented at the time that he could figure out what those reactors would be used for. The same Dick Cheney who insisted that non-fuel cycle capable reactors were somehow proof of Iran's bad intentions.

Source: "The Silk Roads" by Professor Peter Frankopan.

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