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17 February 2018


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While I'm personally pretty skeptical of the "Deep State" conspiracy theories, I think it would be good and fair game for Mueller to investigate those properly. I doubt anyone who believed in those conspiracies would be convinced if Mueller didn't find evidence of wrongdoing, but it's still worth having him do what he can to get to what really happened.


Murali Penumarth

I agree with your list regarding Mueller's investigation and the results to be published, I doubt very much he will move on from the first item in your list. May be h may find some convoluted case of collusion in the first item I am pretty certain he will not look into the rest of the five items. My 2 cents.


I agree about the needed actions, but who is sufficiently "pure of heart" to be trusted with this work? Finding an unbiased observer here is like the Greek philosopher Diogenes with his lamp searching for an honest man. Failing that, who is the 'least objectionable' investigator?


ambrit et al

Consider it to be a rhetorical challenge for Mueller. pl


Colonel, happy Saturday from the golden state.
I agree and hope Muller does all these other investigations you are asking and listed above, after all he was hired to do an unbiased investigation in interests of us all. But unfortunately, IMO he is not going to swim in an upstream battle against the Borg’ intention. IMO either the Borg will be fine and satisfied with a judgment against the no shows proving Clinton lost due to Russian meddling in US elections, or, they will continue to witch hunt anybody and everybody they can grab that is close to President, until they unseat him.



I agree with you that the questions you posed should be answered.

An interesting point in all this high stakes drama is that a federal judge has ordered Mueller to hand over all related documents to Flynn. If there is exculpatory evidence then Flynn could withdraw his plea and Mueller censured.

I did read the indictment of the Russians and to my non-lawyer eyes, it read more like a political document rather than a criminal indictment. Mueller provided both sides reinforcement of their talking points. Hillary and the Democrats can confirm she lost the election due to a bunch of Russian trolls who spent a few million dollars and upended her billion dollar campaign war chest. Trump gets to confirm that there was no collusion. The charges seem very silly to me. And if ever there is a trial with these defendants challenging the prosecution I can see how they can win. But of course no one would pay any attention to the trial as the indictment is the desired endpoint that the media and the Democrats want. In comparison to the foreign money and influence operations of the zionists, the Saudis and of course many British politicians and their media during the last election, the operation by these Russians charged was more nonsensical. It would be absurd on the face of it that a bunch of Russian trolls could influence the election in any meaningful way.

With respect to the potential conspiracy at the FBI, DOJ, and the IC, can Mueller really investigate his own colleagues and personal friends? I think he is a card carrying member of the Borg elite.

Pacifca Advocate

I agree on all these points. Yet your ideas seem like daydreams, phantasies fashioned out of a hope that is not based in reality.


The OIG is investigating some of this and there is a report due out in March I believe.

Indeed the entire mess needs daylight.

Lee A. Arnold

Going along the lines of the Manafort indictment, Mueller ought to determine whether any of this illegal lobbying, money laundering, bank fraud, tax evasion, etc., extends into Congress, and/or whether Trump or his campaign people knew anything about what Manafort was doing.


All very good questions and one more either related to, or subsumed within #s 3 and 6 is whether Steele/MI6 are "targetable" for having meddled in the 2016 election.

Rosenstein unaccountably failed to mention yesterday Mueller’s having landed a really, really big fish on February 2, the unwitting colluder and witless Ricard Pinedo (age 28), a small town scammer who operates a fake ID business out of Santa Paula, CA, a 80% Hispanic farm worker town in boondocks California. Pinedo plead guilty to one count of identify fraud and had, apparently, profited to the extent of some $10,000 or so from the sale of identify and banking information on-line with only a minimal amount sourced from any of the 13 defendants in the indictments. http://www.latimes.com/local/lanow/la-me-ln-richard-pinedo-mueller-investigation-20180216-story.html. The MSM, apparently, like Mr. Mueller has decided not to make a big deal out of the Pinedo indictment for reasons which remain the subject of speculation.


I agree that the list should be investigated - especially the DNC "hack" hoax as that involves screwing with the investigation of a Federal crime and has counterintelligence implications and could lead to lots of indictments.

However, as someone else pointed out in the last thread, Mueller's only remit was to find evidence of Russian government "meddling" in the election and/or "collusion" with Trump and the Trump campaign - which he has not found yet and is highly unlikely to find. The 13 indictments are a joke in that regard.

We need a separate, really non-partisan investigation for the rest of the list. I think it would be possible to find competent investigators outside of the more politicized agencies who could be vetted for any political bias before being assigned. Investigation is investigation - you just need a place to start and a list of people to talk to. Facts then shake out.

different clue

If Mueller does not look sufficiently into the "rolling Soft-Coup" aspects of all this, let us hope that the Congress and the Administration together can force into existence a Special Counsel with all of the powers and staff and funding that Mueller currently has/ will have. . . . to look into the "rolling Soft-Coup" aspects of all this.

If such a counsel would look into the "letting Clinton off the e-mail hook" aspects of all this and esPECially into the "who shot Seth Rich" and "e-mails . . . hacked or leaked?" aspects of all this, so much the better.


as long as Mueller is investigating Question 1 everything is fine, if he starts to investigate questions 2-7 then i think democrats might remember Mueller service for George w bush, and might start thinking about impeaching mueller


I agree with all the questions. The issue of Russian meddling is a no-brainer--of course Russians meddle, just like Israelis, Saudis, Turks and maybe even the US' own intelligence agencies. Proving the meddling and material impact (no harm, no case?) will be more challenging.

IMO Russian meddling's damage to democracy pales in comparison to the damage done by Democrats' and Republicans' mutual recriminations, the spread of fake news by both sides, and the descent of the media into sensationalist fear-mongering backed by few facts.

If Mueller has the guts to impartially expose the truth, then our democracy has a chance of surviving the frontal attack on the idea of an informed public that has long been considered a fundamental pillar of a democratic society.



A full-throated effort to get Donald Trump to resign is ongoing. No meetings in a Rosslyn parking lot are needed. An impartial investigation is required if there is ever to be trust in Constitutional government again. The world is turning really weird. I swear that I heard on the radio Donald Trump say: “I love, love, love the military”. To this old drafted, ex-Spec 5, I remember thinking that is nuts. But, a search of Google, Bing and Duckduckgo and I can’t find in written down anywhere. Either a Borg/Mogul PyschOp has seized the airways or I am mucking things up.


James Woolsey on whether the US interferes in other countries elections:

"Only for a very good cause and in the interests of democracy". But Russians interfering in our elections is totally unacceptable. I don't see how war with Russia is anything other than inevitable.


"I don't see how war with Russia is anything other than inevitable."
If they (the spoiled brats of Deep State) could, they would have started the war already. It seems that they have some informed people around, who have explained the happy warriors (for other peoples' expense) that, in our times, initiation of a war with a nuclear power is suicidal.


James T

I have known Woolsey for a long time including when Clinton made him DCI. Supercilious, arrogant, hyper-aggressive, ignorant of any military reality. He is an arch-neocon of the worst sort and always was. He was a Henry Jackson staffer. pl



I sure hope that they close their dog and pony show sooner rather than later. I'm just one among many of my felow Americans who are mad as hell at the Fumbling Bumbling Idiots and DOJ, the blood of those poor kids in Florida is all over the FBI/DOJ's hands. Their behavior is inexcusable!


Not only that, but it seems that State could care less about U.S. National Security, they prevented the FBI from following through with arrests on Chinese MSS agents. IMO White House nomination of the inept State's Thornton needs to be withdrawn.

Also, it seems that the FBI is more concerned about tweets than protecting our nation's children


Why isn't Mueller going after Soros, after all Soros has stated that America's destruction would be the culmination of his life's work.


It appears that Mr. Mueller is following a true and tried method by going for the low hanging fruit first and squeeze it to get enough juice to go further up the tree and the bigger fruits. Nobody knows the extent of Mr. Mueller's knowledge, but it appears to be rather deep and wide.

I suspect we have only seen a small portion of what will ensue with much more to come. In the meantime, a lot of speculation will thrive. I do not know whether this investigation will eventually impact Donald Trump. Somehow, he may be undone by women first.

FB Ali

Anna, thank you for your comments on this thread. They (and those of some others) reassured me that I wasn't a nutjob wandering about in a room full of sane people. As for many of those others who have commented here, I would submit the following.

Relax! This whole Mueller business is just part of the games that your politicians play with each other. There's no danger of the Russians taking over your country. In fact, such games are played all the time all over the world - except that its mostly Americans playing them in other countries. They're treated there as a part of life; people shake their heads, and go on with their pursuits.

Of course, if you really need to worry, there's plenty to worry about. Normally, while your politicians playact on their Kabuki stage, the country is run by the establishment - what our host terms the Borg. And, everybody's (relatively) happy.

It's rare for a President to be elected who's not approved by the Borg. Unfortunately, this happened (after quite a long time) in 2016. So, we now have the Borg trying to undermine a President who's not inclined to toe its line. This kind of internecine conflict is bad for the country.

What makes it worse is the fact that in recent years US intelligence agencies have acquired vast powers through technical developments. They have also been permitted, sometimes even encouraged, to step outside their prescribed boundaries. In addition, they have started using some of their overseas tactics at home.

All this is cause for real worry.

Leaky Ranger

Mueller is moving at flank speed:


This is a detour that is nevertheless related to the national security: https://www.veteranstoday.com/2018/02/14/a-breathe-of-fresh-air-in-saudi-arabia/comment-page-1/#comment-703774
"There is now rumored to be a split in the IDF and MOSSAD senior and retired members who also now realize that Israel’s part in 911 is now generally known in various other nations including America in their high military commands. They realize that these entities now want serious revenge and will get it one way or another."
-- If this is a valid analysis then we should expect a greater bleeding of information and more questions for the big shots (past and present) at the CIA and FBI.


From what I gathered, the US interfered in the Russian elections while Hillary was SOS and that the DNC hack is supposedly Putin's response to Hillary. And this was done not to prevent her from being president, but rather to embarrass her, a tit-for-tat. Furthermore, the only tangible effect any Russian operation may possibly have had on the Trump campaign that I'm aware of was a proposed pledge against signing an arms deal with the Ukrainians. That pledge was ultimately not included on Trump's platform at the RNC convention and Trump has since signed a bill into law to supply arms to the Ukrainians.

With that said, after more than a year-long investigation, Mueller doesn't have anything other than a few squeeze toys (like Manafort) and 13 Russians at large in St.Petersburg. There's nothing proving what I stated above and from the looks of things, there never will be.

Now I can believe the Russians hacked the DNC and then leaked the emails, even if no hard evidence is ever produced. It's a reasonable conclusion, although I'm just as inclined to believe the DNC had someone along the lines of Bradly Manning or Reality Winner leak the emails. The Democrats have no problem attracting that kind of crowd into their ranks. But what I can't accept is that Trump--who wants America First and to Make America Great Again, who railed against what he feared would be a rigged election--had actually rigged the election and is a traitor. It's Birtherism all over again, except this time it's being treated seriously. Birtherism, lest anyone forgets, supposed that Obama should have been disqualified as president because he was born in Kenya. In this case, however, we are being made to believe Trump colluded with the Russians and therefore his election should be nullified. It's pure political gamesmanship by those loyal to Obama and Hillary, and by those simply opposed to Trump. It's entirely without fact and has done more harm to American democracy than anything the Russians could have done. And to a certain degree, Trump deserves it for having played into the Birtherism nonsense himself, but not to this degree.

On a final and somewhat separate note, even if the Russians had exposed how Hillary Clinton pressed her thumbs against the scales to tip the primaries in her favor, wouldn't that mean the Russians did what the Americans always claim to do when they meddle in foreign elections, that is to say "help democracy out"? If this is what the Russians did in the end, should we share in the outrage of the Trotskyites among us as they, the proverbial pot, call the kettle black?

blue peacock

Col. Lang

I would suggest one more question for Mueller to investigate:

Which other foreign citizens and foreign governments interfered in the election?

Surely it can't just be the Russian trolls. What about all those European leaders who pitched for Hillary & to a much less extent Trump and that was then disseminated widely and of course "unwittingly" by the US media? Are they to be charged too? Should Nigel Farage be charged for campaigning for Trump? What about Sadiq Khan, the mayor of London who got into a public spat with Trump? Should AIPAC be charged?

Should the Brits charge Obama for interfering in their Brexit referendum?

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