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20 January 2018

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SmoothieX12

OT: I don't know what's the deal, but my browsers (on several computers) allow me to only see discussions till the 100th post, after that--zilch. No amount of refreshing, cash cleaning etc. helps.

JohnB

Its hello to Power Politics. Love him or loath him you cant get away from the fact that Putin knows statecraft. I think someone said Putin plays 3D Chess, Trump plays checkers.

JohnB

TTG - You're spot on Putin is one cold-hearted SOB but he's also effective and the world needs him more than ever.

LeaNder

Great EO. Love it. Although the comment section isn't that easy to follow without the respective markers. Although strictly I like it. ;)

JohnB

Meanwhile this side of the Atlantic a less capable player of the Great Game 2.0 - Boris Johnson repeats the mantra. A syria without Assad

https://twitter.com/BorisJohnson/status/955399236459393024

jpb

Try clicking on 'more comments'.

Ishmael Zechariah

EO @148:
Thanks for posting this important link again. From my perspective it contains the following important "fact",which should be taken into account by the SST community as they are evaluating events:

"Ambassador Jeffrey: The region, and that begins with
Turkey, can -- as I said, the Turks are allowing us to
support the PKK offshoot Kurds in Syria every day
reluctantly, with a lot of bitching, but they do it.
The region, and Turkey in particular, can support
autonomous Kurdish entities to one or another degree -- and
it varies because these are very different kinds of Kurds in
the two countries, in Syria and Iraq -- as long as
it fits, as long as we’re there, the Turks know why we’re there...
"
So, the US knows that the YPG&Co are offshoots of the PKK, despite denying this publicly. We have been saying this for a while-and have been hearing all kinds of rebuttals, including on SST.I hope this settles the issue.
As far as "the Turks know why we’re there"; we do know: to carry water for the izzies. You would never know it if you read the transcript. Go and count the # of times izziistan is mentioned. These policy-makers are not really thinking of the US.
Ishmael Zechariah

Babak Makkinejad

It's the Godfather syndrome - Life imitating Art.

Babak Makkinejad

You are right, The West would need a men of Caliber of FDR and Marshall to negotiate such a settlement.

Will2.71828

@EHSANI22 ?
b/ ultimately the stuff comes from the sage Elijah J. Magnier‏
@ejmalrai

Balint Somkuti, PhD

Therw is a small show more comments tab at the left bottom of the screen. Took me ages to find it too.

SmoothieX12

Try clicking on 'more comments'.

Thank you. Also, thank you for making me feel like a complete dumbass:-)) In my defense--I didn't see the button (link) at all. LOL.

SmoothieX12

Thank you.

Babak Makkinejad

One has to feel sorry for the young people whose lives are being burnt and turned into human smoke across 4 countries - Iran, Syria, Iraq, and Turkey - as they are led - under banners of Marxism, Leninism, Maoism - by venal tribal leaders who embody the worst aspects of the Medieval culture of Muslim world.


David Habakkuk:

Are you paying attention here? The West has also lost Turks.

505thPIR

I have seen multiple posts in this committee of correspondence and other similar blogs advocating for a US withdrawal from many of its bases/presences around the world. Simple question: What are the pros and cons of becoming more isolationist/withdrawing from ME and other areas? Perhaps it is worth of another thread?

505thPIR

worthy of another thread

fanto

EO@148
thank you for this clear eye synopsis and "translations" of BS spread by the ambassadors and other "greats". I have but one question or mild reservation: the philosophers and deep thinkers do have an influence on the world history, IMHO, just think about founders of great religions, at Voltaire, Marx, - they were the people who started the mass movements,

Account Deleted

IZ (#158)

Important fact noted. Thanks for posting that very interesting quote from the retired US Ambassador to Turkey, I think it is worth repeating, it in case anyone missed it:

"..the Turks are allowing us to support the PKK offshoot Kurds in Syria every day.." (emphasis mine)

No doubt he'll claim he misspoke if confronted with this - a lot of misspeaking around these days.

Richardstevenhack

Russia may not need to get directly involved, but I suspect given the preparations Ukraine has made for it that Russia will need to up its support at the very least.

"And who's gonna pay for this black-hole?" No one. It will be a short, swift war with minimal cost, and once the neo-Nazi battalions and oligarchs are out of the picture, things will be quiet for a couple years. This will be cheaper than doling out support to eastern Ukraine piecemeal for the next decade.

The EU isn't going to do any more for Ukraine. As pointed out in a Crosstalk yesterday, the IMF isn't sending any more money, and Merkel in Germany is too involved with her own fading political support to want to take on Ukraine again. Western Ukraine may indeed be considered part of Europe, but eastern Ukraine is going to be either autonomous or completely independent whether the West likes it or not. And the only way the West stays in one piece is if the US sends them money because no one else will.

This is why a Russian "invasion" - more a "anti-corruption clean up" than an invasion - would be the best thing that ever happened to Ukraine.

Account Deleted

D (#127)

I'd hazard a guess it may have something to do with whose troops are now on the ground in Afrin. A picture tells a thousand words.

confusedponderer

Balint,
ah, Orban, the current King of Hungary.

I recall reading before christmas that in Hungary, the country with about the lowest immigration percentage in all of Europe (they are at what ... 3% or so?), Lord Orban ordered christmas markets to be guarded by armored vehicles, because of ... 'terror'.

http://hungarianfreepress.com/2016/12/20/tanks-appear-on-the-streets-of-budapest-following-berlin-attack/

That's quite an act from a dude who iirc happily declared his country 'basically immigration free' and said that "influx of Muslim refugees poses a threat to Europe’s Christian identity".

So, as for stupid, I daresay "Oh yes".

I wonder, if there basically aren't any immigrated folks who want to stay in Hungary, who was he protecting the markets from, with armored vehicles? Bombs? Pickpockets? Gypsies? Soros? From himself? Does he want to save european christianity?

It was IMO just a dumbass 'look how hard I am' show, perhaps also a christmas gift.

Saying hello to anybody, as the 'knoellchen' story underlines about views of such 'permanent guests' to things like 'rule of law', is a folly, but what Orban does, in the absence of such 'permanent guests' and their silly ideas, is IMO much just the opposite form of silliness.

It's one thing to be "very careful" or "very careless".

Then there is to be very careful in the absence of a threat while calling for EU money to finance the 'hordes of immgrants'. That is what's called paranoid and greedy. That, and then there is that nasty word that starts with 'j' and ends with 'erk'.

That sort of game is what Erdogan's Turkey is currently playing with the EU also: "Make us a EU partner, and give us a lot of EU money - or we'll let the refugees from Syria (which we help(ed) to generate) loose on Europe". That's 'blackmail', or with Erdogan, 'greenmail'.

The only thing Orban's Hungary has to do with immigration of muslims to europe is that Hungary is 'a station on the way' to more attractive places.

IMO Erdogan and Orban play the same tune, only on different instruments.

fanto

Confused Ponderer,
please explain in plain English what you mean by

quote begin
Saying hello to anybody, as the 'knoellchen' story underlines about views of such 'permanent guests' to things like 'rule of law', is a folly, but what Orban does, in the absence of such 'permanent guests' and their silly ideas, is IMO much just the opposite form of silliness.
quote end

because I am reading this and rereading and still do not know what it all means. I must be too dense, it seems. Maybe you or others will explain it to this ´nitwit´ (LeaNder´s pet description of herself - which I am adopting for myself).

English Outsider


Apologies. I didn't know the transcript had already been posted. Should have guessed.

confusedponderer

fanto,
I'll try to be clear in three points, but it may be you don't like what I'll write.

It is this:

Point (A)
Hungary has a population of some 9.8 million folks. To help you get the idea of how many immigrants live among them look at this map. Look at the orange spot and what it means.

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Demographics_of_Hungary#/media/File:Hungarians_in_subregions.png

The numbers of faith focus in Hungary's english wiki entry also speak for themselves: Of the Hungarians 52.9% are listed as 'christian', 38.9% as Catholic, 13.7% as Protestants, 0.1% as Orthodox, 0.1% as Jewish. Oddly, the mumbers don't quite add up rightly, but you'll get the point.

And then: There is a 1.7% score of 'others' (less than 170k persons). That'd be less than two folks of a hundred folks who isn't christian or jewish.

Think of that and consider: Where then is that Muslim horde that according to Orban is endangering and destroying Hungarian and European Christianity? Well, dunno where that Muslim horde is, but most probably it isn't anywhere in Hungary.

Perhaps they are the 1,7% 'others'? If so, that'd be some 170.000 of Muslims endangering christian identity of the 9 million rest of people in Hungary, and the many more millions in Europe.

Convincing? Hardly. My city has 1+ million citizens, and 31+% or so of them are immigrants - that's be some more than 300k folks. The point is this:

We're speaking of one single larger city with probably almost twice the number of immigrants than housed by entire Hungary. By and large we get along.

Point (B)
The folks who fled through the Balkan and Hungary to the more generous core of Western Europe likely passed through Hungary simply because it was on the way.

The rest of Europe may be wrong or foolish by being more generous or welcoming to immigrants than Orban - that depends on one's point of view - but that isn't the point here and it isn't Hungary's point either.

Point (C)
That's what I mean when I say that Orban is telling a load of brazen BS when he demands more money from the EU, refuses to take his share in immigrants, declares his country 'immigration free', is barb-wiring his border and while lamenting loudly the threat of the oddly absent muslim hordes.

It seems, the 'muslim horde' is his preferred tool in a blackmail game with the EU. It doesn't has much to do with reality, and it isn't honest either. IMO it has much more to do with wagering and gambling.

English Outsider


Fanto - I's guess from what you've written before that this is very much more your field than mine. Not that I'd lay claim to any particular field of study though I'm quite good on pig keeping and have been known to brew a reasonable cup of tea.

But we'd agree, I think, that certainly since the Enlightenment one can only say - show me a big political ideology and I'll show you a pile of corpses. The sketchiest outline of nineteenth and twentieth century history is sufficient proof of that and we're not breaking the run in the twenty-first. As to whether we the people drive the ideology or the ideology drives us - isn't that one of the things we come to the Colonel's site to find out?

Such enquiries aside, "by their fruits ye shall know them" is surely a good working principle to apply to the various ideological cross-currents, "Left" or "Right", that we are caught up in today.

"By their fruits ye shall know them" is also a good working principle when we come to look at the practitioners - those who run our affairs for us in the West and who, ostensibly at least, hold to this or that current ideology or way of thinking when they're devising their policies. And the fruits of those practitioners are bitter indeed.

On that working principle, if I'm not misapplying our host's dictum above, I can only cheer when he says "A pox on them all and they should be marginalised."

You and I might have slightly different ideas on how, but that's a detail.

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