Israel is testing Russia ...

 

"If reports are confirmed, this will be another sign of the growing Israeli military activity over the ongoing Syrian war caused by a series of success of the Syrian-Iranian-Russian alliance against ISIS across the country.

On September 7, the Israeli Air Force carried out a missile strike on a Syrian military facility near Masyaf town located west of Hama city in central Syria. The strike allegedly hit a weapon depot at the medium-range ballistic missiles plant located in the area. Some pro-Israeli sources speculated that a chemical weapons plant became a target of the strike.

At the same day, Israeli Defense Minister Avigdor Liberman said that Israel is ready to do everything to prevent a Shi’ite corridor from Tehran to Damascus and to defend own interests in the region.

Israel increased its military and media activity over the Syrian war after Tel Aviv had failed to get a Russian support in an attempt to influence the US-Russian negotiations aimed at reaching a final settlement agreement over the conflict in Syria.

The Israeli media even accused Russia of providing a diplomatic cover for Hezbollah in the United Nations Security Council.

Tel Aviv is deeply concerned over the collapse of ISIS in Syria and Iraq and fears that the Syrian crisis could be solved in a way ignoring a major part of Tel Aviv’s “interests” in the region."  SF

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Israel's self image is being severely stressed by the survival of the Syrian Government and the failure of Israel's attempt to instigate rule in Syria of manageable and fragmented jihadi and semi-secular groups. 

A concomitant feature of this Syrian Government survival is introduction of Iranian Revolutionary Guards Corps troops from the Al-Quds force and their allies in Lebanese Hizbullah.  These forces have played a significsant role in preserving the Syrian Government.  They now are taking their places as a key element in containing Israel at the line of the Golan Heights.

The Israelis do not like that.  Their current "life illusion' centers on Iran and its little friends as avatars of the larger world gentile menace.  The specter of a "Shiite land corridor to the Mediterranean " is dominant among people like avigdor Liberman.    "We will do what we must!" is the threat.

Russia stands in the way of this fantasy of regional domination by what is really a very small state heavily armed and heavily funded by an ignorant and distant giant.

For the Likudnik world view to prevail Russia must be taught a lesson.  The Israeli air attack on Masyaf, carried out from the neutral sanctuary of Lebanese air space and this move forward of Israeli ground forces farther into Syrian territory are opening gambits to see of the Russians can be bullied into accepting Israeli 'moral" dominance in the Middle East.  pl 

https://southfront.org/israeli-troops-enter-militant-held-area-of-beer-ajam-in-golan-heights-reports/

Comments

[Philippe]

"and then respond in some asymetric way"

Totally agree, ex-PFC Chuck. That's Vlad method since the beginning of Russia's involvement. Contrary to US with his "obligatory Grand Standing" responses and postures. It's not - It has never been - a question of proud ness mal placée, just efficiency. That's the only real metric.

[Ex 11B]

Thus the moniker I assigned them...cheap whores. At least sell us out for more than that. Its pathetic

[Philippe]

Quotes : "Send the foreign nationals (...) back to where they came from."

"lose their American citizenship and are deported, their property confiscated."

"only way to eliminate the infestation."

Hmmm, very disturbing remembrance here, sir, to say the least. Have you lost any memory of the last century ? That's the kind of phraseology which has preceded one of the worst time of our western culture.

And, in case of, no, I have no sympathy for the Zionist ideology, quite the contrary. But I'm French, and I know first hand the dark follies bred by this social disease : antisemitism.

[BrotherJoe]

Did the russian attacks on the oil convoys damage the oil infrastructure or hinder reconstruction?

[turcopolier]

Brother Joe

Obama was the sentimental fathead that he often is. No, Russian bombing did not damage the oil facilities. that is what the US command told Obama but he would not listen. POTUS has absolute command. pl

[Philippe]

Meta-comment - first part to be deleted.

Really sorry, Colonel, I have mistyped the HTML end mark for "italics".

here it is :

[turcopolier]

Phillippe

I see that you are on "laposte.net" Is that expensive? you say these "quotes" ar equotes. If they are you must give us citations. If they are your inventions or a reference to historical statements say so. Don't imply that these are quotations from real Americans if they are not. pl

[Klaus Weiß]

Unfortunately, Germany, the most influential and strongest European country is excluded from this discussion for historical reasons. Russia, or: the Soviet Union, has been the strongest supporter of Israel over the centuries. Without the USSR there wouldn't be a Jewish state in the Middle East. The incremental genocide of the Palestinian people has been ignored by every American administration since Reagan (remember him urging Begin to stop the holocaust in Beirut in 1982). Israel will get away with it.

[DH]

I agree with Chuck, too. Give them enough rope to hang themselves. But what would the asymmetric response be? I guess taking back the Golan would be 'too soon.'

[jdledell]

I can assure all of you that Israel would definitely rather have ISIS on their Golan Heights border than Hezballah. While my sources in Israel are unable to determine if this is Israel's official strategic position, the talk in the IDF definitely prefers ISIS. The IDF is very concerned about Hezballah's military capabilities - they fight like an organized military unit with effective communications and intelligence gathering capabilities. This is much more effective than a bunch of ISIS crazies running around shooting their guns but much less organized than Hezballah. The IDF will probably never forget their experience invading Lebanon.

[LG]

sir, he quoted parts of ex 11b's comments to this post (comment #14)

[Huckleberry]

However controversial, I have learned that it all makes more sense if you stop saying Israelis and start saying "Jews."

Then, if you simply insert "goyim" for every other group of people the Jews deal with, the clarity becomes terrifying.

Dancing around this for reasons of political correctness is suicidal.

[Anna]

"...that kinda explains why the usa for the longest time was always turning a blind eye to isis presence in syria and iraq - looking after israel was at the top of their agenda..."
You mean, Israel has been looking after Israel from the ziocon-occupied USA?

[Anna]

"...Israel is doing everything it can to provoke a Russian response..."
Actually, Israel has been behaving in the most sheepish (and dishonorable) manner re Russian Federation. Israel's provocations have been enormously harmful for Syria, but Israel is powerless to provoke Russia to a point of the US initiation of the WWIII. Such engagement would be a quick end of Israel, forever.

[Lemur]

In New Zealand we often have sheep dog trials at our rural events. The objective is to herd sheep through various obstacles in the least amount of time. A good dog learns the optimal strategy is to control the general direction of the sheep. It's almost impossible to directly control every movement of such volatile animals. So the dog follows a few meters behind, running two and fro in an arc of about 60 degrees, funneling the sheep toward a fixed point.

Russia is pursuing a similar strategy. In conjunction with Iran and Turkey, they're gradually building a regional matrix of power that simply circumscribes the field of choice available to Israeli leaders. Israel can still run hither and thither between a shrinking set of responses, but none of these matter if they're being systematically excluded from the high ground of the regional security complex.

[Anna]

The previous suggestion that Syrians/Russians should provide Lebanese with the effective defensive weaponry (for example, manpads) seems a right way to show Israelis their proper place. Enough already. Would not it be great if the US re-channels the "Israeli" $$billions towards helping the US citizens in Texas, Luisiana, Florida, Georgia, and South Carolina?

[Anna]

Please, do not conflate anti-Zionism and anti-semitism. The ziocons have inflicted an enormous harm through their treachery and disloyalty. Perhaps you are not aware of their role in the promoting the crimes against humanity in the name of Greater Israel. Would you agree that the long prison terms for the warmongering ziocons would be better solution than sending them to live in their pet project or you believe that any investigation of ziocons' crimes would be antisemitic? http://www.historycommons.org/context.jsp?item=amid1982perlefeith

[Lemur]

I thought he sounded quite reasonable.

The Holocaust doesn't exempt the Jews from us parsing their behavour, and responding appropriately (this being the key word) to it when it runs contrary to our interests. There is no apriori reason why a justified counter-semitic position cannot be taken. If John Doe is falsely accused of a crime, or disproportionately punished for one; it does not now follow John can never commit a crime or be punished for doing so. You're kidding yourself if you think opposing Zionism, a non-trivial strand of Jewish culture, is not a form of anti-antisemitism.

I also resent the implication because one expression of Western civilization at a specific point in time did something wrong, all of Western civilization is suspect and must be put on probation. Apparently the second we have a self-affirmative about ourselves we must instantly wonder: would a Jew feel conformable about my inner disposition?

We're stepping over this moral dreck. We won't survive if our organizing motif is a negative.

[Bandolero]

pl

Is Israel testing Russia - or is it more like Israel is testing the US?

Sure, Israel is testing Russia, but from what I read from a guy called Elliott Abrams over there at the CFR blog, it looks to me even more like Israel is testing the US. Quote begin:

"Israel's Bombing of a Weapons Factory in Syria: What Comes Next?

... Israel has given the United States fair warning that there are limits to what Israel will tolerate in Iranian conduct and the Iranian presence in Syria. ... Israel is also acting in part because the United States does not seem willing to restrain Iran in any serious way in Syria. We are doing less, not more, while the Assad regime’s forces and Iran’s gain ground. ... What would be useful at this point, it seems to me, is a statement by the United States that we approve of the action Israel took, and that in the event of a conflict Israel would have our support in defending itself—for example by allowing the Israelis to have access to the stocks of weapons that we store in Israel. This is the billion-dollar stockpile of ammunition, vehicles, and missiles in the “War Reserve Stockpile Ammunition-Israel.” Such a statement might, like the Israeli bombing of the weapons factory in Syria, help persuade Iran and Syria to observe the limits Israel is imposing, and might help avoid a wider conflict.

Quote end. Source: https://www.cfr.org/blog/israels-bombing-weapons-factory-syria-what-comes-next-2

[Yeah, Right]

An appropriate response from Russia would be one that doesn't escalate the situation but puts a stop to the IAF making user of Lebanese airspace.

Transferring AA missiles to Hezbollah wouldn't do it: that would be an intolerable escalation in Netanyahu's eyes, one that runs the risk of causing the Israelis to launch a war on Lebanon under some thinly-veiled pretext.

But how about Putin wangling an "invitation" from the Lebanese govt to mount standing patrols of SU-27 fighters over Lebanon?

From the perspective of int'l law that would be perfectly legal, and Israel would have no legitimate reason to challenge those patrols while on the other hand those Russian jets would have a legitimate reason to challenge any Israeli jet that enters Lebanese airspace.

No idea if the Lebanese govt would be open to issuing such a request, but it would certainly cause consternation amongst the Israelis and do so in such a way that limits their ability to run to Washington crying foul.

After all, the correct response to an airspace that is patrolled by Russian fighter jets is.... not to fly your own aircraft into that same airspace.

Anything else is *you* provoking *them*, not vice versa.

[turcopolier]

All

Whoever turned on the italics, turn them off! pl

[Willybilly]

When over Lebanon's territory, Israeli jets fly very high, well above manmads reach... When they attack Syrian territory, it always happens at night, very low altitude and lightning fast, over and out in a flash.... Hizbullah has manmads, SAM8s, and other systems in place...., but the decision to show its hand has not been necessary for now...., but they do not have BUKS for sure.....

[Bandolero]

All

What I find quite interesting is the question whether Putin may link his reaction in the UNO to the recent NK nuclear test to the US reaction to this Israeli attack on the Syrian military facility. I looked to find a discussion of that possible Russian option somewhere, especially in Israeli and US media, but I failed.

Any suggestions?

[Stumpy]

attempt to clear italic

[Stumpy]

attempt to clear italic