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22 April 2016

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LeaNder

From the link Tigermoth posted above, to the Boris Johnson's complete statements in the Sun:

http://www.thesun.co.uk/sol/homepage/news/politics/7095695/UK-and-America-can-better-friends-than-ever-Mr-Obama-if-we-LEAVE-the-EU-says-Boris-Johnson.html


"Can we stand on our own two feet? Yes we can.

Can we build a new and prosperous relationship with the rest of the EU, based on free trade and intergovernmental cooperation? Yes we can.

Can we speak up for the hundreds of millions around the continent who also feel estranged from the Brussels project?

Can we once again be the champions of democracy? Yes we can.

And by doing all those we can thrive as never before – and therefore be even better and more valuable allies of the United States."

HankP

If Obama and the rest of the US government feels strongly about Britain staying in the EU, I don't see what the big deal is about him telling them. It's a major decision and I think the people over there should hear about the full range of likely effects before they vote, especially from a major ally. As I recall, France recommended against invading Iraq, that turned out to be good advice that we should have listened to.

Kooshy

Colonel Lang , if I may, and not get you upset with me again, I think I understand Mr. Obama' attitude / arrogance with the Europeans, some times even I hear this from my own relatives living in Europe or some closer European friends, they say you in America think you own Europe because you protect us, and rebuilt our economy fifty years ago. Nevertheless, correctly so, America has rescued, safeguarded, rebuilt and defended Europe and Europeans from their own mess at least since WW2, so it comes natural, specially with the Borgistas to have a sense of ownership or a protectorate over them and tell them what to or not to do for their own benefit. So IMO it's not far out for president Obama to tell the Brits what they should do. But is also correct that US' sense of ownership arrogance with Europe is much milder and more in level, then with defeated far easterners and third world countries. An old French collage roommate, few years ago during the freedom fries episode told me, "This bossy feeling often is not realized / recognized with you in America "

HankP

Col. Lang -

I think we'd have to pull out of NATO (effectively killing it) to avoid our treaty responsibilities, right? As long as the treaty is in place I don't think we can avoid responsibility, treaties have the force of law.

cynic

Here's something from someone who may be a bit cracked in thinking that the German intelligence service manipulates the world, but he has an interesting view of Obama.
http://www.veteranstoday.com/2016/04/22/push-off-obama/

'Obama was born in or near Mombasa in what was then the Coastal Protectorate of Kenya. Neither of his parents was a US Citizen. His claimed mother, Ann Dunham, came from a disloyal family – her mother was under FBI surveillance in 1944 as a suspected saboteur at the Boeing B-29 plant in Wichita Kansas, and has been implicated in the theft by the Abwehr of a set of B-29 blueprints. It’s a fair bet that the Dunhams didn’t join in the celebrations on VJ-Day with any enthusiasm. Ann Dunham by the way wasn’t pregnant in the July of 1961, although she is supposed to have given birth to the future president a few weeks later (a shorter gestation than the Chilcot Report!).

Obama was actually born a subject of His Highness the Sultan of Zanzibar, the suzerain of the Protectorate, which was British Protected territory, not a British colony. He became a Citizen of the Republic of Kenya on Kenyan independence in 1963. It is probable that he acquired Indonesian nationality on the marriage of Ann Dunham to an Indonesian citizen named Lolo Soetoro. He never acquired US citizenship by naturalization, preferring to rest on the fraudulent claim to citizenship by birth.
I am of course ignoring the forged birth certificate posted on the White House website, as is the Intelligence Community. It wasn’t even a skilful forgery, indeed it appears to have been photo-shopped. It was good enough to fool the New York Times, CBS and the Washington Post, not that you have to get up too early in the morning to fool that lot, no offense intended.'

Can there have been such a thing as an in-valid President? Is there an American equivalent of lese majeste? As a Muslim he can't even have taken a valid oath to uphold the US constitution, since he must be committed to the triumph of Islam throughout the world.

What comes next? Can Hillary simply claim to have bought the office?

HankP

Babak -

Funny, one of the common conservative complaints is that Obama doesn't believe in American exceptionalism.

Tyler

Don't worry guys. Emperor Trump will make foreign relations great again.

turcopolier

hankP

I have stated repeatedly that I am in favor of withdrawing from the NATO Treaty and all similar treaties. Let the Europeans deal with their own problems. The Cold War ended some time back. pl

turcopolier

kooshy

You are an imperialist. I am not. Khalilzad once said to me at the top of his voice in public that native sons of the US do not understand the uses of power. Good!! pl

Stonevendor

This article makes it sound like the Mail was making things sound worse than they were. I gather the president of the US and British P.M. were of a like mind and what he said was not out of line. You may or may not agree with him, but it doesn't sound like he went off half cocked. http://www.usnews.com/news/articles/2016-04-22/obama-supports-camerons-call-for-uk-to-remain-in-eu

As ar as the Saudis.... release the 28 pages and let the chips fall where they may.

turcopolier

Stonevendor

we are happy to accept your allegiance. pl

HankP

Col. Lang -

Sorry, I missed seeing that. It certainly does seem to be an alliance in search of a purpose after the fall of the USSR.

different clue

Matthew,

A worse Jihadi Arabia government, especially if it included some of the bitter aging ex-Baathists from Iraq, might decide that if it can't sell the oil anywhere because of cordon sanitaire boycott; that it will simply set fire to all the oil wells for pure Earth Heating spite. The precedent already exists as per their retreat from Kuwait.

If KSA were to become Islamic Emirate of Arabia, let us hope that Iran and Shia Iraq could conquer, hold and secure all the oilfields first . . . to keep the IEA from setting all the wells on fire.

different clue

Margaret Steinfels,

The DC FedRegime and the Borg are even now pushing for fast and hard passage and signing of TTP and TTIP, which are designed to achieve the same loss of sovereignty and destruction of democratic self government through seemingly-different means.

different clue

asx,

Oh? Poland and the Baltics can't do that all by themselves?

BraveNewWorld

You can read the whole thing and it isn't very long here. Or you can read the meet of it which is article 5 which you can interpret to mean any thing you choose it to.

http://www.nato.int/cps/en/natohq/official_texts_17120.htm

Babak Makkinejad

In fact, the historical constraint on the exercise of power after the demise of Roman Empire must have been a contributing factor to the "Rise of the West".

In the East, Far, Middle, and Ear, the unconstrained exercise of political and executive power created human misery and death - century after century.

East sank, West Rose - that just about sums it up.

Babak Makkinejad

DOCUMENTAIRE

A voir si vous avez le temps...

Les Français estiment qu'ils ont peut-être un problème d'image. A qui la faute?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vU3IUhZsOGs

----

But also consider the Greeks; they sold themselves to Germany rather than walk out, print drachmas and tough it out - all for a few trinkets from Europe.

Herr Hitler should not have invaded Greece; he should have just bought them out right.

Fred

Babak,

'would one expect a Franco-African or an Anglo-African to ever be elected to such an analogously high position of power in France or in UK"

The quality of political opponents in 2008 had a great deal to do with his getting elected.

Babak Makkinejad

I think those Americans who do not subscribe to US Exceptionalism are rare and in-between valiant souls that keep that belief well hidden.

Dubhaltach

Please specify which of the multitude of politicians to whom your comment could apply you are referring. I'm starting to feel dizzy.

Dubhaltach

In reply to turcopolier 22 April 2016 at 09:04 PM

Be careful what you wish for ! :-)

Seamus

Having a high IQ only proves that you are good at IQ tests, and nothing else.

Seamus

Then again, England's patron Saint was actually Palestinian.

rjj

such "conservatives" are political trannies using the media loo marked "conservative" to take the piss.

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