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15 August 2014

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Tyler

This is a common viewpoint among many of the Western nations that have been on the receiving end of the communist/progressive "long march through institutions". Look at the UK, where the police are terrified to arrest Muslim immigrants for fear of being called racist but have no problem with midnight raids to arrest to people for "hateful" tweets.

This also applies to firearms and the 2nd Amendment as well. My wife, an NZ citizen, did not understand the utility of such a thing when she first moved here or how such a thing would come about. Now though she gets it - from how our country came about (rebellion against tyranny) and how the 2A stands as a warning to any would be tyrants.

JohnH

I wonder how Canadians, particularly Stephen Harper's ilk, talk about Palestinians, other Arabs and Muslims. My guess is that, given their worldview, they parrot US talking heads, which would presumably make them guilty under the law for contemptuous and hateful speech.

Farmer Don

AS I understand it, MONEY is free speech in the US.
So Corporations and rich people can spend an unlimited amount during elections to, in effect, buy the candidate of their choice & then have the laws written for their benefit.
This is not the case in Canada. We have strict limits on election spending. Thank God.

You need another trust buster like Teddy Roosevelt who made it illegal for any business or CEO of a business to donate to a political party.

Medicine Man

In our defense, there are plenty of Americans who have limited views of what liberty means in the US.

different clue

The political/economic advantage-seeking classes who have undone TR's legacy in that regard will work very hard to stop another TR from restoring that ban, or from even emerging.

Now people and/or groups with the big money can buy up all the good "speechfront property" and hope the blogs and specialty presses they can't buy up from us will not enable us to hurt them very much . . . or at all.

turcopolier

All

It does appear that slamming the US and Americans is acceptable up there. BTW someone asked me the other day how my re-immigrating Canadian ancestors traveled from Maple Grove to Eau Claire. Any thoughts? There was a series on TV many years ago called "North and South" in which the "cunnel" (Patrick Swazie maybe) got on his horse with his boys in Virginia and went home for a visit in South Carolina. The next scene showed them riding down the "alley" between the 20 foot high boxwoods to the Taraesque pile. My wife asked me how long the trip would have taken. I told her maybe two days. It is perhaps 500 miles. "How?" she asked. "They would have taken the train," I replied. pl

nick b

One thing I greatly enjoy about this site is that it causes me to learn about, and look deeper into, many things I would not ordinarily come across in my day to day life. While poking around the subject of hate speech in Canada, I ran across a very interesting article. It is from a Journal out of Duke law school: Law and Contemporary Problems. The Article is written by Kathleen Mahoney and is titled: The Canadian Constitutional Approach to Freedom of Expression in Hate Propaganda and Pornography.(1992) Here is the link: http://scholarship.law.duke.edu/cgi/viewcontent.cgi?article=4123&context=lcp

The Author spends the first half of the article discussing hate speech and draws many comparisons between the US and Canada throughout. One in particular struck me:

"The Charter is not constrained by the textual or political constitutional imperatives of the American first amendment, but more importantly the fundamental structure, historical, and circumstantial differences between the two constitutions require a distinctively Canadian approach. Although both countries share a democratic ideal, they do not share the same view of social and political life. In sociological terms, Canada and the United States experience some of the same realities of heterogeneity of population, of language differences, and of original native population. In this dimension, definition and reconciliation of minority rights have been central to civil liberties politics in both countries. But a major ideological difference is Canada's rejection of the melting pot approach to cultural diversity adopted in the United States in favour of a mosaic approach. One of the objectives of the drafters of the Charter was to develop a bilingual, multicultural country and a pluralistic mosaic."

There are many other similarities and differences that author goes into with an emphasis on the Canadian approach. If you are interested in the subject, the article is long, but worth a read.

AEL

Col:

Slamming the USA is a necessary part of English speaking Canadian's heritage.

For a couple of centuries Canadians have chosen not to import American style "Liberty" given its associated costs. This is not an uninformed choice, the vast majority of Canadians live within a few hours drive of the border.
Furthermore, there are significant population exchanges across the border. We have many Americans in Canada and there are many Canadians in America.

In other words: Liberty is over rated.

turcopolier

All

"Liberty is over rated" If you thought Canada was not a thoroughly foreign country that statement should settle the matter. pl

John Minnerath

"Liberty is over rated"
I can not believe anyone with more than cotton between their ears could make such a statement!

different clue

AEL,

How much Slam America might descend from the bitter descendants of bitter UELoyalists who fled to Canada after losing the war here?

nick b

JM,

I agree with you, but our 'liberty is overrated' is a sentiment that clearly exists in the US. It may not be phrased that way, but it's still there. Look at the threats and restrictions to our liberties today: our first, second, fourth, fifteenth and other amendment rights are restricted, or even discarded, in preference for safety, social order or just plain politics. Many critiques of the alleged decline of US society are based on the premise that there is too much liberty in the way of egalitarianism and individual rights. I believe liberty it better described as a double edged sword rather than overrated. Perhaps this is what AEL alludes to when he mentions its "associated costs". I would always prefer more liberty than less. Still one cannot deny that forces exist in the country that feel the opposite.

The beaver

Colonel

Everything/one gets slammed here except for Israel, Jews, the Shoah and calling someone a Nazi under this current govt.

In subtle words, even politicos can show their bitterness about those Muslims, Arabs, Chinese investors who come to save the govt's ---, those Quebecois who dare complain or even the first nations' people. They are localized.

One more bill you should also look at : Bill C-24

Medicine Man

"Liberty is over rated"? Hilarious.

I think everything AEL says is basically accurate, save for his mistaken conclusion. What is hilarious about this fallacy is that it is uttered on a blog where the tendency of some Americans to view their culture as universally desirable is lambasted almost daily. Check yourselves, gentlemen.

turcopolier

Beaver

I suspect that the "mosaic" view of Canadian society became popular after the Anglos discovered that the French were not going to become Protestant and Anglophone. that was early on expected. Franklin said as much. The Brits contributed to this outcome by ceding so much to the church in the Quebec Act. pl

turcopolier

MM

OK. I still think Canada owes me a passport since my ancestors French and Anglo founded the place. Failing that I want a Quebec passport. pl

Medicine Man

Col.: If I but had the power, I would be happy to make it happen.

John Minnerath

Wrong words. Our liberty is abused is more like it.

kao_hsien_chih

I think it is also a good summary of why attempts at exporting American values at gunpoint fails so often, starting with 1812 notwithstanding Jefferson's neoconish delusions about Canadians being secret Americans yearning for liberty(tm). Even if "liberty" might not be overrated, people don't have the same sense of what it means nor are they willing to accept it (or its various incarnations unconditionally. No amount of self righteous insistence coupled with pseudoscientific sophistry can change that...whether with Canadians or Kansans.

MRW

O mon Dieu! Séparatiste!

turcopolier

mrw
"O mon Dieu! Séparatiste!" Only if my demands are not met. pl

FB Ali

Joking aside, many newcomer communities in Canada are very grateful (even if they don't say it loudly) for Quebec and its status in the Canadian constitutional structure. So long as it is there, there are definite limits to what the 'Anglo' majority can do. This has been greatly reinforced by Pierre Trudeau's Charter of Rights, and its enforcement by our (non-political) courts.

turcopolier

FB Ali

Having a foot in both camps up there and having someone who studies Canada for a wife it has become apparent to me that Canada would be a curious place without the French much as Lebanon would just be part of Syria without the Christians. pl

Fred

AEL,

"Liberty is over rated." When you no longer have any you will find it is a bit late to change your opinion.

Medicine Man

FB Ali,

I'm grateful for Quebec. To quote our host, the Quebecois are a wonderful foil to the centralizers in Ottawa. I was grateful for their presence under Chretien and am doubly so under Harper.

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