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26 July 2014

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Castellio

Two questions, Babak.

Who, in your scenario, speaks for Islam? And what needs to happen before the declaration is made?

John Adamson

Thanks for the link to the American Friends Service Committee Gaza Relief.

I sent a donation.

johnf

The BBC has just reported the death of another IDF soldier, putting, they say, the total up to 43.

I got the impression that yesterday the figure was in the low 30's. Today there's been a truce.

Perhaps that incident I referred to upthread with 8 IDF soldiers being killed in an APC on Thursday the 24th really did take place. Anyone been keeping a closer count?

Cee

43rd IDF soldier dead...Barak Refeal Degorker 27 years old

Cee

David,

Donated. Thank you. I also use Amazonsmile and a percentage of every purchase goes to Doctors Without Borders.

Andrew

@Haralambos - Jeez forget I asked... Whata' condescending ----!

Babak Makkinejad

Ayatollah Khamenei could make such a determination; so could collection of the Shia Doctors of Religion - singly or collectively.

If the timing is judged correctly in the political/emotional sense when such a declaration is made, other Muslims will have no choice but to follow.

It would be a repeat of Ayatollah Khomeini's Fatwa against Salman Rushdie. At that time, no Muslim political leader dared go against Ayatollah Khomeini's Fatwa and I expect similar thing in this event as well.

Babak Makkinejad

Your first question: at the right moment - Ayatollah Khamenie.

I do not know the answer to that, I would speculate that it would have to be an atrocity by Israelis on such a massive scale and such emotional outrage that he would be compelled to take a drastic action.

Lee

Having difficulty finding Israeli wounded - anyone find a decent source?

Cee

Lee,

I've found nothing. This is interesting

Richard Silverstein tells the story:

I’ve devoted a good deal of my life to Israel. I’ve studied, read, visited, lived, breathed it. Not in the way diehard pro-Israel fanatics do. But in a different way that matched my own intellectual and political proclivities. It’s a subject that is rich, varied, troubling, bedeviling, and exhilarating. But every once in a while I learn something I never thought possible; and I don’t mean this in a good way.

Tonight, my Israeli source informed me that Sgt. Guy Levy, serving in the armored corps, was captured by Hamas fighters. He had been part of a joint engineering-armored-combat unit searching for tunnels. Troops entered a structure and discovered a tunnel. Suddenly, out of the shaft sprang two militants who dragged one of the soldiers into it. By return fire, one of the Palestinians was killed, while the other fled, presumably with the soldier.

This Israeli report, which was censored by the IDF, says only that the attempt to capture the soldier failed. It says nothing about his fate. The expectation of anyone reading it would be that the soldier was freed. But he was not. In order to prevent the success of the operation, the IDF killed him. Nana reports that the IDF fired a tank shell into the building, which is the same way another captured soldier was killed by the IDF during Cast Lead.

Cee

My hands are shaking from rage...

http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2014/07/26/israel-murders-idf-soldier-to-prevent-his-kidnapping/?utm_content=buffer769b2&utm_medium=social&utm_source=facebook.com&utm_campaign=buffer

Castellio

Andrew, I don't think he meant it the way you took it.

Castellio

Very much worth reading, too, is a more recent posting: http://www.richardsilverstein.com/2014/07/26/israels-slaughter-based-on-a-lie/

He calls for Bibi to be charged as a war criminal. As well he should. And he should be charged in his part in the stealing of secrets and nuclear material from the US as well.

He shouldn't be getting 29 standing ovations from Congress. That was a shameful day for America, at that moment a defeated nation.

johnf

Guardian reports 9 Israeli soldiers killed today (Monday) bringing total to 52.

Cee

Thank you Castello and I agree!


Daily count:

Four IDF soldiers killed in mortar fire on Eshkol

Rocket fire at Israel resumes with vigor after unofficial ceasefire between Israel and Hamas ends; rocket alert sounded in Zikhron Ya'akov, Binyamina, Hadera, Caesarea, other cities in northern Israel.

Itay Blumenthal, Yoav Zitun
Latest Update: 07.28.14, 21:48 / Israel News

Four IDF soldiers were killed, while at least six other people were wounded, some seriously and criticially, by mortar fire on Eshkol near the Gaza border early Monday evening. Because this was a mortar and not a rocket, there was no Code Red siren.

Poul

http://dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2014/Jul-29/265391-israel-targets-symbols-of-hamas-control-in-gaza.ashx#axzz38q0YFvfA

"A Palestinian health official put the overall Gaza death toll at 1,110. Israel has lost 53 soldiers, including four killed Monday in a mortar attack in southern Israel, along with two civilians and a Thai national."

Fred

Not to worry, the IDF just blew up the one electric plant in Gaza. Congratulations must be in order.

http://www.al-monitor.com/pulse/security/2014/07/electricity-gaza-protective-edge-idf-humanitarian-crisis.html

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.607757#!

Kyle Pearson

Interesting video here, of a Hamas raid on an Israeli outpost. Looks like it was manned by two IDF infantry.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=5NAhozItSq0

Cee

Mark Regev denies it on CNN, of course!!!

Info on more IDF deaths...

Yesterday, a devastating tunnel attack by Palestinian fighters inside Israel killed five soldiers in a border outpost inside Israel. The IDF put out a story that turns out to be false, that they were killed by an RPG rocket that struck their pillbox killing them. A Hamas video of the incident shows that this version is a fraud. Actually, the enemy fighters crept up on the outpost in the early evening and killed the five at virtually point-blank range.

Haaretz, not one to rock the boat in any extreme fashion in such potentially embarrassing circumstances, offers this:

The video does not show Hamas militants firing an anti-tank missile at the forces, as the Israeli military had reported.
http://www.richardsilverstein.com/

Poul

The Gaza Health Ministry said 1,270 Palestinians, most of them civilians, had been killed since Israel began its offensive on July 8 with the declared aim of halting cross-border rocket fire.

While the Israeli army has reported 53 soldiers and three civilians killed so far, Hamas says that 110 have been killed.

Read more: http://dailystar.com.lb/News/Middle-East/2014/Jul-30/265478-operation-kills-10-israeli-soldiers-hamas-video.ashx#ixzz38xroHVCb
(The Daily Star :: Lebanon News :: http://www.dailystar.com.lb)

Poul

Gaza officials say at least 1,361 Palestinians, most of them civilians, have been killed in the battered enclave and nearly 7,000 wounded. Fifty-six Israeli soldiers have been killed in Gaza clashes and more than 400 wounded. Three civilians have been killed in Palestinian shelling in Israel.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/07/31/us-mideast-gaza-idUSKBN0G008720140731

Poul

Gaza officials say at least 1,427 Palestinians, most of them civilians, have been killed in the battered territory and nearly 7,000 wounded. Fifty-six Israeli soldiers have been killed in the fighting and more than 400 wounded. Three civilians have been killed by Palestinian shelling in Israel.

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/01/us-mideast-gaza-idUSKBN0G008720140801

Poul

Another mortar hit costs five IDF soldiers their lives. So 61 Israeli soldiers have been killed.

http://www.haaretz.com/news/diplomacy-defense/1.608331

"On Thursday, five Israeli soldiers were killed by Palestinian mortar fire near the Gaza Strip border, raising the number of Israeli military fatalities to 61. Earlier that day, two people were wounded by rocket fire in the southern city of Kiryat Gat.
...
According to the Gaza Health Ministry, the Palestinian death toll since fighting began is now 1,458, and the number of wounded has risen to over 8,200. "

Poul

http://english.ahram.org.eg/NewsContent/2/8/107728/World/Region/Egypt-presents-Palestinian-truce-demands-to-Israel.aspx

"Gaza officials say 1,804 Palestinians, most of them civilians, have been killed and more than a quarter of its 1.8 million residents have been displaced. Israel has confirmed that 64 soldiers have died in combat, while Palestinian shelling has killed three civilians in Israel."

Poul

http://www.reuters.com/article/2014/08/10/us-mideast-gaza-idUSKBN0G907R20140810

"A month of war has killed 1,910 Palestinians and 67 Israelis while devastating wide tracts of densely populated Gaza.

Gaza hospital officials say the Palestinian death toll has been mainly civilian since the July 8 launch of Israel's military campaign to quell Gaza rocket fire.

Israel has lost 64 soldiers and three civilians, while heavy losses among civilians and the destruction of thousands of homes in Gaza have drawn international condemnation. "

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