"Israel offers deal to rescue peace talks" The Telegraph

"Israel has proposed a deal to rescue the peace talks, offering to release 26 prisoners if the Palestinian leadership “cancels” its bid for greater international recognition. Yuval Steinitz, the Israeli intelligence and strategic affairs minister, told The Daily Telegraph that this exchange could be a way of continuing the negotiations brokered by John Kerry, the US secretary of state. His words suggest there is a possible opening to prevent the imminent collapse of the peace process, which had appeared to be in tatters last month when Israel failed to release 26 prisoners, prompting the Palestinians to sign up to 15 United Nations conventions. Under the US-mediated agreement last year, Israel promised to free 104 prisoners in four groups of 26. The Palestinians had agreed not to use their upgraded membership of the UN to sign any international conventions."  Telegraph

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And BTW, part of the deal has to be that we release Pollard. 

This is all very interesting,. The Lilliputian state of Israel, armed to the teeth and dependent on the United States seeks to dictate terms to the US for a renewal of "negotiations" over a possible peace between said Lilliput and the Palestinian community.  The US is not really an interested party.  The US is seeking to broker someone else's deal.  So, why are we willing to bargain with Israel over this? 

We deserve to be treated this way.  Our situation is somewhat analogous to that of parents who are dominated and bullied by children who have learned that they have nothing to fear from such parents.  pl 

http://www.telegraph.co.uk/news/worldnews/middleeast/israel/10755559/Israel-offers-deal-to-rescue-peace-talks.html

Comments

[Perhaps this]

As Juan Cole wrote today in his blog, Secretary Kerry testified to the Senate Foreign Relations Committee it was the Israelis who torpedoed the talks:

"In exchange for the deal being kept of the release of prisoners and not going to the U.N. Unfortunately, the prisoners weren’t released on the Saturday they were supposed to be released. And so day went by, day two went by day three went by and then in the afternoon when they were about to maybe get there, 700 settlement units were announced in Jerusalem. And poof! That was sort of the moment.”

[Fred]

Meahwhile Kerry is silent on the expulsion of Palestinian's from Jerusalem. Give up 26 'prisoners', expell 20,000 residents and we yield up a traitor, proving to everyone outside the beltway just who's in charge of the superpower.

http://gulfnews.com/news/region/palestinian-territories/israelis-may-expel-hundreds-of-jerusalem-palestinians-1.1317771

[Old Gun Pilot]

As Juan Cole wrote in his Blog today, Secretary Kerry testified before the Senate Foreign Relations Committee that it was the Israelis who torpedoed the talks. Cole quotes his testimony:
"In exchange for the deal being kept of the release of prisoners and not going to the U.N. Unfortunately, the prisoners weren’t released on the Saturday they were supposed to be released. And so day went by, day two went by day three went by and then in the afternoon when they were about to maybe get there, 700 settlement units were announced in Jerusalem. And poof! That was sort of the moment.”

This may be a slip of the tongue, but it may also be an intentional warning to Netanyahu of a hardening of the administrations policy toward Israel.

[jon]

I'm not a Palestinian, but it seems that a strong step towards national recognition and international status is worth more than the release of twenty six prisoners.

Meanwhile, the Israelis continue to bomb Gaza, expand settlements, appropriate Palestinian land and olive groves, and create yet more barriers and indignities to movement. It's remarkable that there hasn't been another Intifada.

[ikonoklast]

All

Perhaps I'm not reading the situation correctly as to the Palestinian position. What is the downside from their perspective to seeking international recognition? Besides losing the prisoners in question, is Israel still in a position to sequester their overseas aid?

As to continuing to appease Liliput, and especially as to returning Pollard: (expletive deleted).

[Charles I]

You have never been at the utter mercy of Zionism and the IDF. They control most of the water and power, and all trade and travel. They enter communities to humiliate, assault, kidnap, terrorize and murder with impunity. Canada is certainly on board for punishing any Palestinian temerity.

[Andrew]

..."Our situation is somewhat analogous to that of parents who are dominated and bullied by children who have learned that they have nothing to fear from such parents.PL"

I guess that happens when the parents need the pocket money they gave their children back,just to get to work.

In case that is not enough leverage the kids can always yelp out "CHILD ABUSE".

http://www.theguardian.com/world/2014/apr/10/bob-carr-accused-of-bigotry-over-diary-claims-of-pro-israeli-foreign-policy

[DC]

The starting point of the analysis of this point within the negotiations should be: "What's in it for us?" Realistically, there's not likely to be anything in it for us, save for the remote chance of a final agreement. But, as immortalized by Lloyd in "Dumb and Dumber" -- "so you're telling me there's a chance." Notwithstanding the unlikeliness of the outcome, isn't one dust-encrusted spy worth that outcome?

Second, we would be worse than dumb were we to act upon Israel's demand as if it were a demand rather than an offer that may be countered. Therefore, among other potential counter-offers: condition the release of Pollard on a final agreement. Release or leak the offer in the public realm. Observe what they do.

Please note that this premise is established within the Universe of Dumb and Dumber. This universe is real for us, and unlikely to change. Might as well continue with the play, no?

[Norbert M Salamon]

ALL:
This offer resembles all previous offers by Israel, with similar results: prologue the "Peace Process", then renege on the promise. Then we start all over again with another promise ad infinitum.
Israel's promises have as much truth content as President Obama's promises while running to get the Presidency [then all promises are forgotten].

[steve]

"Our situation is somewhat analogous to that of parents who are dominated and bullied by children who have learned that they have nothing to fear from such parents." pl

Having taught in various school systems, my analogy would be to a substitute teacher who lets kids get away with some foolishness, the kids can't believe their good fortune with such a clueless chump, and ramp up the foolishness, pressing with ever more outrageous behavior and demands.

Just like Israel. Should have been sent to the principal's office decades ago.

[JohnH]

The "peace process" consists of Israel agreeing to talk as long as others make tangible concessions. Some deal!

Yes, we deserve to be treated this way. We won't take action even when Israel behaves badly in front of our noses and precisely in order to embarrass us.

How exactly does it enhance national security when nations are free to spit in our faces with impunity? How many others are following Israel's example albeit with less public provocation?

[David]

DC,

To establish "good faith" in a negotiation, it is best not to accede all at once to the demands of
the other party, but instead to meet them partly
in order to see the response. Therefore I propose that Pollard's release be extended. That is, one body part of Pollard is released and if the
Israelis make a positive response, then another
part is released.

[confusedponderer]

For a couple days now, Lt. Gen. David Deptula, USAF (ret.) is making the rounds with JINSA's Makovski. Both are pomoting the idea of the transfer of MOPs and B-52s to Israel.

Punchline from JINSA's OpEd in The Wall Street Journal - April 8, 2014:

"The Obama administration has cut a deeply flawed interim deal, forgone new sanctions, and effectively taken the military option off the table. It's time to increase the pressure on Tehran by boosting Israel's military capacity to cripple Iran's nuclear program."

That nuclear program that isn't a nuclear weapons program (US intelligence can't fimnd evidence for that) i.e. Iran's peaceful nuclear program that may or may not, but could, become a weapons program, but for which there are no indications?

The conflation of a nuclear program with a nuclear weapons program is not just sloppy language. It is a deliberate deception. Iran's ability to master enrichment is NOT tantamount to a nuclear weapons threat. A theoretical ability in the absence of intent is not a threat. Period. To say otherwise is engaging in deception.

Let's put this into a clearer language:

They want that US should put Israel in a position so that they can flout US policy preferences by making them independent strategically, this time by giving them a conventional stategic strike option (which, at the same time, is giving testimony to Israel's current inability to successfully hit Iran)?

That's the same idea that was being promoted in 'A Clean Break', which notably stressed that Israel ought to change relations with the United States, by making Israel self-reliant, i.e. independent from the US.

Now that's an ally! These folks want the US to make Israel independent, so we can piss on whatever the US wants them to do and they want the US taxpayer to foot the bill?! And better still, they push a policy that exclusively benefits a US client over the patron, and have it formulated by Americans.

The tail is indeed wagging the dog.

And re: 'A Clean Break' - the other major idea in that paper is that Israel, rather than pursuing a "comprehensive peace" with the entire Arab world, Israel should work jointly with Jordan (though nowadays it looks they are rather more allied with the Saudis) and Turkey to "contain, destabilize, and roll-back" those entities that are threats to all three.

Which goes a long way to explain the current enthusiasm and persistent scheming to have the US to bomb Syria to smithereens already. And then Lebanon. And then Iran.

Is there a cure for this lunacy?

[Babak Makkinejad]

All:

Arabs are in disarray and therefore there is no local pressure on Israel to do anything.

Even Saudi Arabia is collaborating with Israel against Syria and Iran and others.

I think very likely there will be more wars and more bloodshed in the future in and around Palestine.

[Babak Makkinejad]

In case of Israeli attack on Iran, would Germany break diplomatic relations with Israel?

Would France, Italy, or UK?

Would any European state attempt at sanctioning Israel?

I think not.

The survival and preponderance of Israel is a core national security interest of US, Canada, Australia, and EU states.

All these countries are claiming to be democracies and year after year and decade after decade have pursued belligerent pro-Israel policies - without exception.

You want to get Israel out of the Occupied Territories?

Impose on Israel the same "Crippling Sanctions" imposed on Iran.

They will not last 2 weeks.

[jon]

Wow, DC, that might be the ultimate cruelty to Pollard - to condition his release on a final agreement and resolution of the Israeli/Palestinian conflict.

I think the Israelis ask for Pollard's release, because it costs them nothing to ask. They have no genuine interest in a peace deal, so it suits them to make unreasonable demands, and to insist on negotiating points that can never be met.

[Charles I]

Its not a Canadian security interest. Its a political stance.

[Charles I]

Not even failure, per the definition of insanity.

[Norbert M Salamon]

With respect, if Israel attacks Iran [not foreseen at present, but does it in the medium term], it will be ostracized by all oil importers, since destruction of Iran's oil/gas fields [and possibly of some other ones in the Gulf] will immediately raise the price of oil above economically sustainable levels, a.k.a. here comes 2008 with vengeance![This aside form the possible closure of the Strait].

[Imagine]

Israel already has three nuclear-armed submarines in rotation off the coast of Iran. German-built. The Iranians know this; the American public does not.

[Charile Wilson]

We be bitches!

Right colonel.

[YT]

"arabs are in disarray and therefore there is no local pressure on israel to do anything.

Even saudi arabia is collaborating with israel against Syria and Iran and others."

& how long has this "status quo" lasted...?

"I think very likely there will be more wars and more bloodshed in the future in and around Palestine."

Ah, most sad indeed...