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06 April 2014

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nick b

The link to the Hersh story on LRB did make it memeorandum.com, IMO a decent news aggregator site. It lasted for about 6 hours, but seems to be gone now.

Kunuri

jon,

Sibel Edmonds has an incredible wealth of information on her website and her blog that puts all this in perspective. I strongly urge anyone to comb them, like I did, to start with this article and go back to 9/11, and beyond and back. If anyone thinks her Turkish connection revelations are unique, that is exclusive to Turkey, they are wrong. Israel and Saudi Arabia is in the same mode, as being discussed here so many times, starting with lobbying and spying, and going all the way back and forward to false flag operations, media involvement, perception management and downright corruption in all levels of government against the laws and rightful interests of United States, and peoples of all three countries for the benefit of fat cats and self serving elites. Meanwhile, we have starving Syrian refugees in the streets of Istanbul begging for money and a Al Kaida foot soldiers on the way to Europe shooting dead 3 people with AK 47s on the interstate, not too far from here and barely making the news. AKP and Erdogan are albatross hanging over BO's neck, but the only question left now is who will the cool-aid drinking crowd would throw under the bus first. And not who first, or one or the other.

William R. Cumming

I was in Washington area over the weekend for a Celebration of the Life of a deceased friend [Skidmore College Class of 62]! A number of her college classmates present.

As is my wont I touched based with others there an even more resident in the DC area. In discussions most ignored FP but have already started to focus on fall elections and import of SCOTUS McCutcheon ruling.

I believe the rest of the world will have to hold its breath to see what happens this fall in USA!

Kunuri

jon,

I too am a Turkish speaker and I heard the tape where a false flag operation is being discussed in highest levels of the Turkish government. I may even be more sensitive to nuances and inflections about speech then her now that I lived here for a while, and I totally agree that this piece may be a cut and paste operation, something is not right about it. However, even taken out of context, full sentences uttered, create their own context, which nevertheless point to something very odious being discussed. All the more, their willingness to involve Turkey in a war in Syria and pressure US to do the same, for ultimately financial benefit that coincides with a certain circle's, is an unholy alliance of the thieves. And what happens when it is revealed? Thieves throw other thieves under the bus to save their own skin. Wait, watch and see.

Kunuri

JohnH,

Do not despair, 3 or 4 Turkish investigative reporters are piecing this story together and I try to help, oen way which I do is directing them to this site and I had a couple of thank yous so far. Hersh story checks out by me, quite a while back I reported thousands of trucks going over the border unchecked, and somebody here mocked me about the numbers. Sarin gas manufacturing equipment was intercepted here and news disappeared next day. Anyone from border regions will tell you here that Syria Turkish border is a free pass region. Take the recent false flag tape that came out, add some more free source info and Hersh has a story. Add more Sibel Edmonds revelations for background and a picture starts to emerge. And it is ugly. I expect much more to come out soon, and dramatic developments regarding Syria, Turkey, and projects some people have cooked up decades ago.

jon

Thanks, Kunuri, your perspective is interesting. Edmonds' bio states that she spent part of her childhood in Turkey. In her video, she specifically mentions that there are no mentions relating to the US, EU or NATO, and that those would be omnipresent in a typical exchange. She thinks this relates to Erdogan and AKP wanting to win the election, and willing to go to any lengths to improve their chances.

Frankly, I'm shocked at their willingness to be so deeply involved in Syria. I had the impression that Turkey prided itself on having good relations with all of its neighbors. The uprising makes Turkey's Kurds more restive. The new crop of jihadis may be more militant and fundamentalist than the AKP prefers. There's enormous refugee and relief pressure. Should Assad fall, I'm not entirely sure how this improves things for the AKP or for Turkey.

Edmonds also remarks on the obvious penetration of the Guhel organization deep into the police and executive branches. Turkey's government may be riven with factions, working at cross purposes to each other and to the national interest. It's fascinating to this outsider, but very opaque.

bernard

Jon said: "I had not thought that Turkey would be so deeply, or directly, involved in a false flag CW operation."

Let us recall for a moment what was done here (according to the report): HUNDREDS of innocent civilians (men, women and children) were DELIBERATELY MURDERED (thousands injured) in a 'false flag' gas attack for the SOLE purpose of getting the US into a war with Syria which looked likely to escalate to a regional war or possibly even a world war.

One would think this is a MAJOR story.

Now plenty of people would have better search skills than I have but when I hit Google news and also the ABC news search site I couldn't find a SINGLE LINK to this story.

There were links to the usual suspects: Antiwar.com, firedoglake, PressTV etc - but the mainstream corporate media including the Australian public broadcaster (ABC): NOTHING.

I've been a long time reader and supporter of Chomsky but this performance by the MSM is AWESOME.

PS. To be fair http://whoghouta.blogspot.com.au/ hasn't commented on the Hersh report yet either so perhaps I should give the MSM a little longer to digest the story?

Macgupta123

I think Obama's initial response was in line with that of most American Presidents (e.g., invade Granada, invade Iraq, invade Panama, etc.). People generally behave per the norms of the society they are in; and Democrats, and a black Democrat in particular are vulnerable to the charge of being weak, of being unwilling to use force.

To Obama's credit, he listened to the evidence and to the generals, and maybe to his better self, and did not go to war. I don't think he went to the dark side; he escaped the perpetual dark side that is American foreign policy.

nick b

This is on the Daily Beast this morning. It's not as dismissive as some of the other criticism I've read.

http://www.thedailybeast.com/articles/2014/04/09/seymour-hersh-gases-turkey.html

confusedponderer

You're aware that Voltaire was joking over Gottfried Wilhelm Leibniz?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Gottfried_Leibniz#Theodicy_and_optimism

different clue

Fair point. Our host has reminded us at times that Obama has ended up not quite choosing the war-option that neocons and neowils wanted. But it certainly has seemed to me at times that he really really wanted to.

My feeling of darkside-ness on his part is more based on his domestic policies and choices which were entirely his choice. And his cynical lying behavior as detailed on Naked Capitalism and elsewhere.

Stephanie

Hersh shopped around his December story to the WaPo and The New Yorker and presumably others - no takers. Possibly they are all terrified of The Awful Truth or maybe they had some issues with his sourcing. He seems to rely very heavily on one particular fellow. Sometimes Hersh is right. Sometimes he isn't. I'm not dismissing all this out of hand but I wouldn't take this one to the bank.

turcopolier

Stephanie

Hersh has been frozen out of the major media by the apparat, as have I been. pl

David Habakkuk

Stephanie,

The single most significant claim made by Hersh in support of the contention that the Obama regime was attempting knowingly to disseminate disinformation relates to the British facility at Porton Down.

Note that it was not denied by them.

British defence scientists were ignored when Blair and Sir John Scarlett disseminated the bogus intelligence which facilitated the invasion of Iraq.

I think it eminently likely that, faced by a JIC who appeared quite ready once again to collude in the dissemination of disinformation to justify a potentially disastrous war, the scientists refused to play ball.

klaman

Curious about Sy Hersh. Once again his "Breaking news" is nearly a year old. Seems to be his specialty- getting credit for others' work.
The Libya-Stevens-Turkey pipeline via NATO has been WIDELY discussed and VERIFIED by dozens of sites all across the internet for close to 2 yrs now.

Suddenly, this RIIA /CIA agent comes in and "exposes" what the heavily derided "conspiracy theorists" proved back in 2011 already in the weeks immediately following Benghazi.
Since the info has become so commonly accepted, guess its time for the MSM to send in their man to collect a Pulizer (again for others' work).
Should we say Puketzer

klaman

Yes but YOU actually have insider, new breaking data and impressive creds. Hersh takes stuff a year or more old and passes it off as new discovery.

World of difference between the two of you. You are real. He is another MSM fraud

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