Not so fast. Not so fast.

"Asked if their presence in Washington this week had helped contribute to the lopsided vote, Republican Sen. John McCain said: "Yes." It's a sentiment at least three other Republicans echoed in conversations over past several days. "I might not vote the way they wanted me to vote, but giving them the chance to be heard, giving them a chance to tell their story meant a lot to them and it meant a lot to me," Sen. Johnny Isakson, R-Ga., said Tuesday after he met with the families. "I'm not going to vote for a filibuster. I think they deserve an up or down vote." Not all the relatives of those killed at Newtown are supportive. One father appeared earlier this month at a National Rifle Association-sponsored event and spoke out against new gun laws."  NBC News

------------------------------

This bill will be subject to an open amendment process on the floor of the senate.  This means that a long process of debate and votes on amendments will take place.  Reid announced after the vote today that the Manchin/Toomey agreement will be the first amendment offered.  That amendment will be considered first.  That amendment will deal with the issue of just how "universal" backgroud checks will be.  The amendment will establish that federal background checks will be required for "commerrcial sales" but also limited in that federal checks on non-business gifts or sales will not be required.  IMO, without that provision this bill will fail of passage.   there will also be amendments offered with regard to what the anti-gun people call "assault weapons," and "large capacity magazines."  IMO the "assault weapons" ban is another inclusion that would doom this whole law.  Illegal gun sales to second parties unqualified by law at present would become a federal crime when weapons are transferred across state borders.  pl 

http://firstread.nbcnews.com/_news/2013/04/11/17709187-newtown-passion-moves-senate-vote-on-guns?lite

Comments

[Edward Amame]

As I wrote earlier, licensed federal dealers could report the transaction without giving the buyer's name. Or gun owners themselves could document transactions. But talk about disingenuous, any uni background check bill looking to set up a fed registry/extensive record keeping hath not a chance in hell of passage.

[no one]

"Because some 85% of guns recovered in crimes in New York City were originally sold out of state."

That's not really an answer. All it tells me is that your city is a mess; a failed multicultural experiment full of determined criminals.

A couple hundred miles away, in the same state, there is a gun in almost every household and we are not killing each other at anything approaching the same rate (excepting the few urban centers full of minority welfare crack heads like Rochester and Buffalo).

You are completely failing to realize that your problems are not my problems. I am not enamored with your city or your lifestyle. I do not in the least appreciate your city's attempt to alter my lifestyle and my freedom because "maybe" some policy will alleviate, to some extent, what ails you.

If NYC sank beneath the ocean tomorrow my only concern would be whether or not NYRA would extent the Saratoga meet to compensate for the loss of Belmont and Aqueduct. I wouldn't miss you in the least. Do you get that at all? You are not America. You are a subset and a weird one at that. It is your narrow perspective and arrogance that makes you think that I am willing to alter my life to fit your concepts and needs.

We are at an impasse and I won't discuss this topic any more.

[no one]

P.S.

http://www.nydailynews.com/new-york/nypd-statistics-show-96-percent-shooting-victims-black-hispanic-minority-groups-represent-89-percent-murder-victims-article-1.1152838

The link is what I meant by failed multiculturalism. The problem is guns, it's disenfranchised minorities.

[Tyler]

So in your reality the ATF/DoJ wasn't trafficking rifles with no real oversight, with one of those rifles killing BPA Brian Terry.

Hurr, a dead agent is now a fever swamp. Stay in NY.

[Tyler]

Yes, why acknowlege facts when you might be called out by another fantasy islander surrounded by armed guards.

Hypocrisy? What's that?

'Fever swamp', 'nutty'. You've wandered far from your echo chamber, eddie. The strains of maintaining your doublethink are starting to show.

[Tyler]

Well we agree on that point, at least.

[Tyler]

Well stop acting like such a bullshit caricature then.

The militarization of the NYPD is what keeps your city safe, somewhat. That and the stop and frisk policy that acknowledges racial realities (that can't be replicated anywhere else in the country without the DoJ civil rights mandarins swooping in), and of course compstat fraud.

On second thought, the NYPD would have to get rid of the Glocks with 12 pound triggers and learn to shoot straight to be militarized.

[Edward Amame]

"Well stop acting like such a bullshit caricature then."

The pot's calling the kettle black.

[Edward Amame]

You assume I'm utterly unfamiliar with the clan of conservative victimhood. I'm not.

[Tyler]

Since you lack the facts, I take it with this response we're at the petulant response phase of the argument.

[Tyler]

What victimhood? Your side is the one of ethnic greivance politics and doublethink (most gun crimes are with handguns....we should ban assault rifles!).

Seriously, what color is the sky in your world?

[Edward Amame]

I've said this before in another thread and I'm repeating myself, so I'm sorry, but I would like to make this as clear as possible, Tyler.

I don't have much, if anything, invested in this issue. I am not a gun owner and I am not someone who has lost someone to gun violence or even considers guns a real concern in my little corner of NYC. So the gun issue is not in the top ten list of concerns that I would personally like to see dealt with nationally/federally. But it's been thrust on us all by events and if I have to pick a side, it would clearly be with the side pushing for expanded gun regulation.

Because Congress has made it clear that there will not be anything resembling a national gun registry until hell freezes over; in Heller, SCOTUS ruled that the Second Amendment creates an individual right to possess firearms, but as Scalia wrote in the majority opinion, the Court had no quarrel with “laws imposing conditions and qualifications on the commercial sale of arms.” So the howls of outrage from the gun lobby over the milquetoast-y gun legislation being proposed for the first time in 20 years leave me scratching my head. Yes I know the devil is in the details, but that stuff could be worked out if both sides had to. But both sides apparently don't want to -- the NRA/Rand Paul are now running ads against Susan Collins in Maine.

[John Minnerath]

It certainly seems you do. You continually suggest more restrictions should be placed on gun owners regardless of any consequences.
Typical, pass more laws and try to figure out what they'll do later.

[Tyler]

What are you talking about? Your entire 'I don't have much interest in this but I'll write essays about it" is pure high school sophistry to try and pretend you don't have any emotional coin in the game. Knock off the bullshit.

NYC has little gun violence because of the "stop and frisk" policies of the NYPD that would be pounced on by the civil rights ransom lobby in a heartbeat if it was tried anywhere else in the country. When Arizona said "yes we're going to enforce the immigration law that the feds choose to ignore" you'd have thought we were shipping anyone with a tan off to camps, but NYC is allowed to search black and latino males with no due cause.

Like John says below me, typical liberal: Its not going to fix the problem, but let's pass a law and pretend we're doing something and maybe something will happen!

Again, how does any of this prevent the mountain of dead children you and yours are standing on to try and take away everyone's guns?

[William R. Cumming]

Okay gun control lost in the Senate! So here is the Cumming proposal to deal nationwide with firearms sales and ownership! Remember you saw it here first.

All adult citizens and permanent residents of the USA over the age of 18 will be able to own 100, exactly 100, firearms. The acquistion and disposal of those 100 will be subject to the following [and those who wish may feel free to propose a different number]!

First over 100 firearms and you will be considered a gundealer and registered and regulated and taxed as such on sale of any firearm. You will not be allowed to be a gun dealer if you meet certain proscriptions and cannot post bond in an amount of $10000 for each weapon sold as having been sold to someone with 100 or less firearms and having no adverse background information, convictions or arrests for certain offenses including domestic violence, and certification that you the customer are not taking prescription psychotropic drugs nor any illegal drug and will be drug tested at random by the authorities for controlled substances and subject to a $10,000 fine if you flunk.

Back to the 100 firearms for personal use. You must maintain a log and serial number of those weapons subject to inspection by authorities. They must be stored in an approved storage locker when not in use and no individual in the household not have taken part in a familiarization course or under 18 may have sole access to that storage unit.

Those under 18 may not have firearms period except when in an approved training course, on an approved range. They may hunt in the company of a trained guide or parent if they otherwise qualify for possession of a hunting liscense. If in violation of these rules those who allowed it will be subject to a $10,000 fine for each first violation with esclalation for further violations in the amount of the fine.

An authority will be established in each state to conduct periodic inspections of records, including unannounced inspections, and training status, or if none applicable, tested for knowledge of those firearms in possession.

Many will say 100 too many and some will say to few. But the point is that the US will over the decades find out exactly what is happening among those owning firearms and using them. And of course weapons without serial numbers will require recordation by other means.

And all ammunition sales will be recorded and subject to inspection.