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06 January 2013

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Alba Etie

We need to protect our 2nd amendment rights , full stop .

Kevin

With the 4th strictest gun control in the country, it is really hard to purchase and own a weapon in Connecticut. They have a state "assault weapons ban" that was enacted before the former 1994 weapons ban and had more restrictions with less loophole. They have gun registration and a waiting period while purchasig a gun too. Boy, it really did a great job at stopping gun violence! Lets fall down that slippery slope some more.

(Obama's home turf)
http://news.investors.com/ibd-editorials/010213-639108-500-murders-rahm-emanuel-chicago-gun-ban.htm

The Twisted Genius

The Fredericksburg paper ran a story about a week after the Newtown shooting that mirrored your friend's observations. All the AR-16 looking weapons were selling out. The guy at Clark Brothers said this happened after every mass shooting. He expected a lot of the weapons to be returned in about a month after the hysteria dies down. That's part of the pattern, he said. I have no idea if that happens nationwide.

Mark Logan

TTG,

I can confirm it happened out here on the West Coast.

I have a WAG that the Republican lashing-out at the NRA was only the use of an opportunity to express a feeling of resentment over NRA heavy-handedness, which has been building up over the last several years. It's not a sentiment with the depth needed to actually pass or change any federal laws...as some obviously hoped it to be.


Waaay off topic, check out a PNW fixture at every kite exhibition of the last several decades showing off. He is 80 years old, deaf as a post, and makes everybody who has ever tried to precisely fly these sort of kites green with envy.

Three at once:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nr9KrqN_lIg

Tyler

The part about weapons being returned sounds spurious to me tbh. You can bring them to the gun shops, but I don't see them simply giving you back your money because you make a panic purchase.

Herb

True, not one of those provisions would have prevented Newtown, but not one of those provisions would inmpact my owning or using the firearms I own and use, and not one of these hysterical gun hoarders is in touch with the reality that NOTHING IS GOING TO CHANGE. My bet is not one of those provisions, as tepid as they are, will pass.

Beyond the politics, all of those Newtown children and adults, including the mother of the shooter herself, are dead now as a direct result of her ignorance, poor judgment and lack of education regarding rudimentary gun safety, including the proper use of gun lockers, trigger locks, and ammunition storage. He was able to kill more than a handful due to large magazines. But none of the facts are going to change anything at all.

"Gun control", whatever that is, is going to happen when and how gun owners, through the NRA, decide, not one minute sooner and not one measure greater. We will get a loosening on automatic weapon restrictions before another assault weapon ban.

turcopolier

Herb

All true. pl

The Twisted Genius

Clark Brothers displays quite a few used weapons for sale. I'm sure they buy back these month old weapons as used weapons rather than as full money back returns. Given the value of these things, I doubt the seller loses much money in the transaction. I think this particular gun shop also sells weapons on consignment, but I'm not positive on that.

harry

I saw a chart yesterday - which showed an international comparison of gun deaths relative to the number of firearms per capita. The relationship was very strong with the exception of Mexico, which was a striking outlier. Way more gun deaths than you would expect from the number of guns. Switzerland was another interesting example. Lots of guns. Lots of deaths by gun. Right on the regression line. Its not just an American thing. But more guns does tend to be correlated with more gun deaths.

Speaking personally, I would really rather there were no guns on the subway. It wouldnt cheer me up if there were good guns to offset the bad guns. Its just too small a space. It seems to me that the situation in rural areas is radically different to the situation in high population density urban areas. So there should probably be different rules set on a local basis.

Finally I would appreciate it if people who owned guns kept them out of the hands of mad people or bad people. So perhaps a licensing system with tort law penalties if your used gun ends up being used to kill 20 kids? Or if you sell guns to an unbalanced person? How this would work with wholesalers I really havnt thought through.

My opinion - for what little it is worth.

ked

across the South, there has been a similar run on guns & ammo. maybe we should ban purchase of combat weapons by easily-spooked lemmings.

Tyler

Apologies for not clarifying: I'm not saying that they won't take used guns. I'm saying that when someone buys an AR for 2K (the going rate for ARs around here) and they bring it back to the gunshop, they're going to take a haircut.

Now if they take the haircut and the gunshop owner buys it back for $500, then yeah I can see that happening. I was talking more people who buy and then expect a one for one exchange.

Tyler

I'm personally sick of speculators driving up prices and buying things just to try and resell them on craigslist or backpages for a profit.

Of course, there's too many gun shop owners who are willing to stoke fears to sell more black rifles.

Medicine Man

You really have to break down the firearm deaths by category: suicides, domestic violence, crime, accidents, and spree shootings. The only thing these have in common is that they involve firearms. They have different perpetrators, motives, and remedies - if one is inclined to remedy them. Lumping them all together is not productive.

optimax

Switzerland has a high rate of gun suicides and low rate of gun homicides.

Medicine Man

I'm inclined to agree.

As much as I hate to speak ill of the dead, I think a large portion of the blame for Newton lays with the mother of the killer. About the only "gun control" I'd advocate at this point is a greater emphasis on gun education. If I were POTUS I'd probably ask the NRA to design and administer it, with federal funding. For added irony, I'd take the money out of Homeland Security's budget.

optimax

Just like they did to Twinkies, the evil bastards.

Rider

Disagree. Any proposal which would have prevented Mrs. Lanza from collecting her arsenal of semiautomatic advanced tactical firearms would have denied Adam Lanza access to them. If her neighbors and law-abiding fellow citizens also had none, Adam would have been hard-pressed to lay his hands on them, regardless how many neighbors' homes he robbed before getting caught.

Feinstein's ban would obviously do the job. Obama's background checks with strengthened mental checks would also have stopped it. Hopefully, the background check will ask if anyone in the household has been prescribed any of a list of psychiatric drugs, to be followed up with the prescribing physician. Sorry, Mrs Lanza. No sale.

Three-fourths of guns used in America's 62 mass shootings since 1982 had been legally purchased. All illegal guns start out legal. A national database will help track them.

If Adam Lanza had only gone to the school with a couple of. .44s, it would have been bad but probably stoppable. The 30 rounds-in-15- seconds firearms in the Feinstein ban don't belong in civilian hands. They have the mass-lethality of artillery pieces at the time of the second amendment. I cannot accept the notion that the founders anticipated militiamen personally possessing their own artillery pieces.

Respectfully

chandleg

"The 30 rounds-in-15- seconds firearms in the Feinstein ban don't belong in civilian hands."

FM 3-22.9, Rifle Marksmanship, dated April 2003, cites the M16A1's maximum effective rate of fire in semi-automatic mode as 45-65 rounds per minute. The FM cites the maximum effective rate of fire for the M16A2/A3, M16A4, and M4 as 45 rounds per minute. The manual further defines maximum effective rate of fire as the highest rates of fire that can be maintained and still
achieve target hits.

The sustained rate of fire for all 4 rifles is 12-15 rounds per minute. The manual defines sustained rate of fire as a rate of fire that a weapon can continue to deliver for an indefinite
period without overheating.

"Any proposal which would have prevented Mrs. Lanza from collecting her arsenal of semiautomatic advanced tactical firearms would have denied Adam Lanza access to them."

What is an "advanced tactical firearm"? See pl's post regarding "The Ruger 10/22 and the Keltec SU 22." Wikipedia states, "The first successful design for a semi-automatic rifle is attributed to German-born gunsmith Ferdinand Ritter von Mannlicher, who unveiled the design in 1885, " and that "a few years later, American gunsmith John Moses Browning developed the first successful semi-automatic shotgun, the Browning Auto-5, which was first manufactured in 1902 by Fabrique Nationale de Herstal and sold in America under the Browning name." Many contemporary hunting rifles and shotguns are semi-automatic; can you state which parts of the cycle of operation are NOT automated in a semi-automatic firearm? Hence the distinction between semi-automatic and fully automatic. Many contemporary rifles and shotguns can be gussied up to look aggressive.

Last, you throw in a couple of "what ifs":
"If her neighbors and law-abiding fellow citizens also had none, Adam would have been hard-pressed to lay his hands on them, regardless how many neighbors' homes he robbed before getting caught.

"If Adam Lanza had only gone to the school with a couple of. .44s, it would have been bad but probably stoppable."

What if Adam Lanza had had a semi-automatic shotgun? Would he not have wreaked similar destruction? There's no end to some people's desire to make the world hazard-free. Consider the desire of doctors in the disarmed UK to regulate kitchen cutlery.

http://frontpagemag.com/2012/dgreenfield/british-doctors-call-for-ban-on-long-kitchen-knives-to-end-stabbings/


John Minnerath

The anti gun rank and file live in a never never land of ignorance and misinformation.
They simply will never understand that gun control will never end attacks the isolated deranged individual wreaks on others.
Let alone the fact that 99.999% of gun owning Americans are perfectly normal law abiding citizens.

Fred

Certainly the residents of the millions of households with legally obtained fire arms are not collectively guilty of these 62 crimes since 1982 to present?

"I cannot accept the notion that the founders anticipated militiamen personally possessing their own artillery pieces." I hope you can accept the fact that the founders did not accept the notion that a woman like Diane Feinstein could serve in public office at all since women were not even allowed to vote.

Perhaps if Adam Lanza’s mother had received proper training on the care and raising of a child before she got pregnant her son would not have turned out to be a cold blooded killer of children. Isn’t it about time we had Congress regulate that, too?

Tyler

More people died from hammer attacks than from rifles.

When will the Congress do something about the scourge of these assault hammers that have only one purpose: killing people!

optimax

The Founders never considered keeping field artillary pieces out of the hands of citizens, in fact, federal law only requires the normal background check to buy a muzzle-loading gun, including cannon or mortar, made before 1898, or facsimile thereof. If your state law permits you can buy this 1841 cannon which shoots 12 pound balls for $70,000, put it in your frontyard and aim it at the Section 8 rental across the street.

http://www.pbocorp.biz/forsale.php

John Minnerath

Man, I want one. Back in the 60's there was an outfit, Barny's Cannons, that sold a lot of models with a bore sized to a beer can.
I've got about 2000 yards of nice flat open ground out from the house. What fun it would be to lob projectiles with a big black powder front stuffer!

Rider

I stand corrected. I admit to having no knowledge about how long it takes to kill a room full of Kindergarteners. Give me your estimate then of how many minutes it takes a killer with a Bushmaster to fire three rounds each into a room full of them. I will use your estimate henceforth.

Tyler

If you want to go half in with me, optimax, I'll take out a TSP loan and we can make this happen.

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