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02 July 2012


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The Twisted Genius

A similar chain of events is happening in Mali. I see the Islamists are busy destroying the tombs and shrines of Sufi saints in Timbuktu. I guess we won't see the "Festival Au Desert" in 2013.


I had an Episcopalian bishop tell me yesterday that Christians are more discriminated against today than in the past and he mentioned Muslims. What I would like to know is whether it is the more fundamentalists Muslims or if it is more widespread than that?

This has the potential to create a major backlash and since just about the only thing supporting the Muslim world is oil, any diminished use of it will have a major impact on them.

As the old saying goes: Be careful what you wish for. You may get it.



Yes. The Wahhabi takfiris hate Sufis as much as they do Chhristians. pl

different clue

Are they burning ( or looting for sale) all the centuries-old books as well?


Col: The common thread since 9/11 is Wahhabi-funded terror. And yet we act like the Iranians are the greatest threat to peace.

This is so perverse.

Babak Makkinejad

They are Wahabi Takfiris; i.e. they believe themselves to be True Muslims.

They destroy those sites since, to them, they reek of idolatory.

They are also against Shia, Sufi, Druze, Ahmadis, Yazidis, Jews, Christians, Hindus, Sikhs, Sabeans, Jains, Budhists, etc.

The Wahabis are the dominant sect in Suadi Arabia and spent the better part of the last 30 years spreading their ideas all over the Sunni world.

Now, apparently, is the time to reap the whirlwind.

Babak Makkinejad


Several years ago I read on the Internet that the US Government - under George Bush II -had hired the Jewish Agency to depopulate Iran of Jews and Christains.

I am sure it made sense to some people, it did not make sense to me.



"What I would like to know is whether it is the more fundamentalists Muslims or if it is more widespread than that? " Nothing like this in Scaninavia, eh? As I have said here, endlessly, boringly, there are as many forms of Islam and ideas of what it requires as there are Muslims. That is true in spite of the inclination of Muslims to group themselves under the interpraetation of some individual or institution who defines Islam for them. was that helpful? I'll bet it was not. "People" do not want that explanation. pl

Babak Makkinejad

Col. Lang:

In regards to Pakistan:

The sporadic attacks are also against Shia (Pakistani as well as Afghan), Ahmadis, and Hindus.

The Twisted Genius

I thought the Israeli government was also doing its best to bribe Jewish Iranians into leaving Iran. Having a Jewish population willingly living in Iran obviously does not support the Likud/Neocon narrative of a dangerously intolerant Iran. George W. was just doing his part to help his Likud/Neocon buddies.

The Twisted Genius

Isn't a sizeable portion of the Pakistani population also Sufi? I thought I read of Sufi resistance to Taliban encroachment into their valley villages a while back.


A turcopole was a mounted archer of the Ottoman Empire and generally Christian IIRC.

I find it interesting to note that the mostly jewish neocons push for these little adventures and uprisings with little regard of what happens to the people after 'liberty'. If the first thing the Islamists did after coming to power was purge the jews, I imagine we would be at war across the NAME. However its just Christians so instead we've got the nominal leadership of both parties tripping over themselves to see who can be the better lapdog to Israel.

What a shameful state of affairs.



The military religious orders of the crusader period also had turcopoles. pl

Alba Etie

Babak Makkinejad
The Wahabi Takfiris -are they also resposible for the destruction of the Bhudda Statues in Afghanistan ? Are the Taliban Haqqani network also
Wahabi Takfiris. Does the PRC also have its own wahabi takfiris network insurgency to deal with -perhaps elements of the Uighirs ?
Is there a global response possible he Wahabi takfiris whirlwind you describe ?

Alba Etie

Col Lang
I have been trying to read up on the Sunni Wahabee revival- in fits & starts . is it possible we could see another Saladin arise out of the whirlwind that Babak desscribes ? Like in the Crusades - is that why al Qa'ida describes Western troops as Crusaders ?

Babak Makkinejad

There is a Shia response to Wahabi Takfiris.

I am unaware of any other.



Many pious Muslims see the world as a moiety between Islam and the West. AQ are not unusual in that. It is in that context thet rhey describe our troops as "crusaders.' For them the wars of faith have not ended. No, there will not be another Saladin. the Islamic world is too weak for such a figure to have much impact. Terrorism is a strategy of the weak, a mere nuisance. Think about the devastation that we have wrought upon the Islamic World as a result of 4,000 odd casualties on 9/11. A greater attack will result in even greater disproportionate destruction. That is what the idiots who rant about the Islamic "threat" do not seem to understand. The West is not going to convert to Islam and they are essentially powerless against us militarily. Nasser would have been a dangerous man, but he lacked the Wehrmacht as a tool. pl


It would be awhile before Muslims dominate Scandinavia. They would have to learn how to play ice hockey first.

What I am still interested in is how widespread this is within the Muslim community. I also wonder if in the long run they can afford it. I really do not know but there may be some here who know a lot more about it than I do.



"how widespread this is..." How widespread what is? A vague feeling of hostility towards the West? A commitment to violent jihadism? There are a billion Musiims. How is anyone supposed to answer either one of your possible qustions? You think there is literature on this? On the basis of questionnaires maybe? One of the favorite "games" in the Arab World consists of lying to people who ask questions like this. The jihadis even have a medievally sanctioned "license" to lie about these matters. pl

Alba Etie

Col Lang
And what of the Erdogan reforms in Turkey ? Will the Turks be proactive in addressing the Egyptian mess if it goes down the path of the wahabee takfiris ? It seems I have read about the Turkish proactive involvement lately in Somalia -and were not Turkish Special Forces some of the first NATO troops fighting in Afghanistan shortly after 9/11 ? Is this an wahabee whirlwind an existenial threat to the USA in any event ? Perhaps the biggest concern is still some Islamist terrorist network delivering a WMD attack here at home - and although horrible would not be a threat to our continuance as a Country ?
(In an earlier thread you made mention of CoL Wilkerson & Sec of State Powell - I have always been more afraid of the Neo Cons and my civil liberties then of vials of anthrax in the hands of terrorist )


Funny you should mention a Saladin 'rising' from the Middle East. I've personally wondered if we are due for a Cromwell figure rising in the United States.


What scares me is anthrax in the hand of NeoCons.

Pardon my paranoia, but I still suspect that's what happened in 2001. Who else could have arranged for the FBI to bungle the investigation so effectively?

Lord Curzon

You know, we could go round the houses on the whole theological underpinning of the Wahabi/Takfiri/Salafi mindset, but the most concise answer is that, frankly, they're just c&nts!


Does anybody in Washington really care about the fate of the Middle Eastern Christians?

Certainly not Christian Fundamentalists. They cheered Israel on while Palestinian Christians fled in droves. And what about the Christians of Syria?

Interestingly enough, it appears that Russia Today is about the only news organization covering the plight of Christians in Syria.

As usual, it appears that ME governments that are the United States' friends can do whatever they damn well please, even encourage Christians to leave. If they start to cross the United States, however, beware! You will start to see stories like that in the WaPo.

Middle Eastern Christians have become mere pawns in the great game of demonizing your enemies and protecting you allies.

Alba Etie

It was very sad day indeed to see Gen Powell at the UN with that vial selling us all down the NeoCon rabbit hole...

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