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17 April 2012

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Pirate Laddie

Bandages? Bandages!! Hey, tell me what kind you want & I'll show up fully festooned. Even throw in a leg in a cast, if that will help my case. The report of the EMT (if there is one) & the videos at the police station should count a lot more.

ked

Just as potential evidence is destroyed after a possibly criminal act, is it not conceivable that it might also be created?

turcopolier

ked et al

How about sworn testimony from several witnesses? pl

The Twisted Genius

Sounds too much like the neck brace for fake whiplash scam to me. Since having injuries from being savagely attacked by Martin is at the core of Zimmerman's defense, being seen by neighbors heavily bandaged the next day would be a smart move by Zimmerman. He should have been examined that night and had the physical evidence of his injuries noted. That would have been strong evidence for his version of events. I question his decision not to do that, although he was probably in shock and/or extremely rattled at the time.

Tyler

You mean the one that showed a large gash on the back of his head? Or did he manage to invent that evidence as well?

Is no creature as skilled at self deception as man?

The Moar You Know

"What does the medical report on Martin's body say?"

Nothing. One wasn't done.

MRW

A 'large gash' was not visible on his head in the police station security camera footage when he was brought in that night.

Where did you see the 'large gash'?

MRW

Correct. No ME report. Nothing. Just the word of the Funeral Director who, emphasizing that he was not an ME, said that he saw no bruises or indication of a fight.

Oh, but the Funeral Director was black, so I guess we'll have to take the word of Alan Dershowitz.

Matthew

A man picks a fight after stalking a kid who was legally walking a public street and then claims self defense.

That is the argument I would make if I were a prosecutor.

turcopolier

Matthew

"A man picks a fight" You may have a problem with that. pl

turcopolier

MRW

"the Funeral Director was black, so I guess we'll have to take the word of Alan Dershowitz"

What? The word of the funeral director that Martin was unwounded other than for the hole in him, is exculpatory for GZ. pl

Matthew

Col: The authorities have interviewed the girl that Mr. Martin was talking to on his cell phone just before the altercation with Mr. Zimmerman occurred.

Thus, we will have more than just Mr. Zimmerman's claim of self-defense. We will have a witness (credibility unknown at this point) who will testify that Mr. Zimmerman was following and frightening Mr. Martin.

I could go either way on this case. We have two frightened people. We have two people who might have been defending themselves. It's going to be a real mess.

ked

yes, sworn testimony is critical evidence - but one must understand-in-context (or unravel) sworn testimony of human witnesses, just as one must closely examine material evidence.

a violent death is somewhat like a plane crash - there is often a complex chain / interaction of causation & effects. and then there is law, presumption of innocence & juries.

Tyler

Almost Matthew, almost. Your sentence should have read: "A punk kid picks a fight after doubling back to confront a man who was walking down the street and gets killed for it."

Almost only counts for good efforts and schoolboys.

Tyler

Look up any of the enhanced images of what was blurry out of focus footage.

Probably put there by ALEC and the NRA though, I'm sure.

Spafford

Did the neighbors have a look under the bandages? Bandages by themselves prove no basis for injury. Could easily be an attempt to influence. Did the police report contain any significant note of injuries? If so, why was he not examined? If he had apparent injuries and the police did not call for medical attention, would not the police face a law suit? There possibly "appears" to be "created" evidence on both sides.

Medicine Man

Really? That's odd. I would have thought that Martin's corpse would have some injuries, even if GZ's story was 100% correct. Did they just grapple or did Martin strike Zimmerman?

PS

A good rundown of knowledgable commentators by Radley Balko, who is sharply critical of excessive force by police and racial profiling: http://www.theagitator.com/2012/04/16/the-zimmerman-indictment-reactions/

He concludes that it feels like a railroading.

LeaNder

report by Timothy Smith, apparently the first officer at the location

http://tinyurl.com/initial-report-page-3

While I was in such close contact with Zimmerman, I could observe, that his back appeared to be wet and was covered in grass, as if he had been laying on his back on the ground. Zimmerman was also bleeding from the nose and back of his head.

Why did he need bandages in the night he was brought to the police for investigation? It was reported that some one took care of him.

Here the enhanced and re-digitalized video.

http://tinyurl.com/ABC-enhanced-and-redigitalized

The scars in the enhanced and re-digitalized video doesn't look like a fresh wound to me.

Scroll down for the cross scar photo, not sure if this is supposed to be a still:

http://tinyurl.com/cross-wound-photo

What instrument did Martin use, what would leave such a cross wound/scar? What are the black spots right and left to the horizontal part?

LeaNder

Nothing. One wasn't done.

Adam Silverman posted on the article and linked to the affidavit, two days ago:

Assistant Medical Examiner Dr. Bao performed an autopsy and determined that Martin died from a gunshot wound.

Matthew

You don't know Mr. Martin. You never met him. And yet you accuse him of being a "punk" kid. Your hood just slipped.

Tyler

Probably both, all things considered.

I instruct hand to hand fighting and ground combat, and having a person on top of you is one of the most difficult positions to be in and deal with effectively as a trained fighter. For someone untrained and getting pounded in the head, its terrifying on a level that's hard to put into words. The amoutnt of willpower required to fight back effectively takes hours of training and the correct attitude.

I do not think Zimmerman was a trained fighter. I think he was fighting for his life and his mindset is easy to pass judgement on during dispassionate discussion on a message board.

steve

What is a "punk kid"?

turcopolier

Matthew

"Your hood just slipped" You are saying that he is a Klansman? pl

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