The Unintended Consequences of Posting About Extremist Violence

Adam L. Silverman, PhD*

One of the unintended consequences of my two most recent posts have been the discussion as to exactly what extremism is (J's question) and a heated discussion as to what the Southern Poverty Law Center (SPLC) is (discussion between J and MarkfromIreland).  I wanted to take a minute or two and try to get to both.

In the former I use the term extremist or extremist movement for any identity based group (religious, kinship and/or linguistic, political/ideological, social, economic, nationalist, etc) that is both espousing a set of beliefs that are towards the fringes of the larger societies, groups, movements, and/or subcultures that they are part of and whose beliefs are either directly used to justify violence by those that are objectively identified with such a group or subjectively identify with the beliefs of the group even if they have never formally joined anything.  In the former case we are talking about activity by known members of a group like the IRA or the UFF in Northern Ireland.  In the latter we are looking at activity by Timothy McVeigh (please remember that McVeigh never formally belonged to any white supremacist, militia, patriot, and/or Christian Identity group, which is why he was not trackable by those who monitor those networks).  In all these examples we are dealing with people who are white and Christian (members of the IRA being Catholic, the UFF being Protestant, and McVeigh seemed to be loosely involved with Christian Identity towards the end with his connections to Elohim City and his use of Willian Pierce/Ian MacDonald's "The Turner Diaries" as the blueprint for his attack).  I could just have as easily used Jewish, Muslim, Hindu, Buddhist, and other examples but these will do as no society, community, group, or religion is immune to extremism.  So J, I'm not using the term willy nilly, nor am I just bandying it about with impunity.  Contrary to those whose own works were cited as justification by the Norway shooter/bomber, I recognize that words have not only meaning, but consequences and we should strive to be as precise as possible so as not to provide anyone with a loaded gun; even if it is just a conceptual one.

This brings me to the issue of the SPLC.  J you are certainly willing to believe whatever you want, but that's some accusation without any supplied evidence and support.  If the SPLC is the agent of a foreign power, just what exactly are they trying to accomplish with their support: greater civil rights and liberties for less well to do Americans?  Now I know someone who used to work for the SPLC in the day (former cop turned lawyer and now a criminal justice professor) and I just don't see this one, but for the sake of being open minded I did some Internet digging to see what nefarious material I could come up with.  I started with the SPLC, you can view their about information here (this includes links to their board of directors, their senior staff, and their financial statements), and how they are rated in terms of being a charity.  From there I had a look at some of the accusations against the SPLC.  Some of them were in response to their taking a stand against those who organized last Summer's anti-Muslim freak out about the Muslim Community Center near Ground Zero (the aptly misnamed Ground Zero Mosque - and before someone concern trolls this: Jewish Community Center's often have chapels, this does NOT make them a synagogue, and the Twin Towers actually had both a formal and informal prayer room before it was brought down by the violent Muslim extremists of al Qaeda and the Pentagon had and has one- that does NOT make either of them mosques!).  Others were from related groups and organizations or those that seek to carry their water and see everything as a united, networked, conspiratorial Liberal threat to liberty (please note in these links you'll see several references to the Bad Man George Soros...).  Then there is the outright anti-Semitic.  (Click through on all of these at your own fully informed realization that you may read material that is offensive)  I found dozens of links like these, but none of them mentioned anything about being agents of a foreign country.  The closest I got was the first comment in this Huffington Post blog post.  While the SPLC focuses most of its energy on extreme right and extreme religious groups and movements, it has tracked minority separatist movements (whose ideologies often tend to be more leftist) in the past.  The only other really active, for lack of a better term, extremists in the US whose beliefs might be called leftist or left wing are the extremist environmental types.  And the largest, for lack of a better term, of these chronicle their own activities (the link is for the ALF, ELF used to have this stuff up, through about 2001-2002, but it looks like they have radically redone their website.

* Adam L. Silverman is the Culture and Foreign Language Advisor at the US Army War College.  The views expressed here are his own and do not necessarily reflect those of the US Army War College or the US Army.

Comments

[William R. Cumming]

Thanks Dr. Silverman.

[J]

Adam,

I'll say to you what I said to mark earlier, what I said was a 'statement' (a declarative sentence), not an accusation. When an organization or group that is outside the bounds of a bonafide government intelligence apparatus, has linkages with a foreign intelligence apparatus and foreign intelligence operatives (both overt and covert), they then become suspect and warrant further inquiry. Thus is the SPLC.

When our federal/state/local law enforcement seek 'intelligence' from outfits that have linkages with foreign intelligence orgs, they then open themselves up to penetration. Law enforcement agencies which develop such patterns of depending on those 'outside' the realms of bonafide government intelligence for their end intelligence product, they open themselves up to a 'dumbing down' of the picture before them.

I am not talking academic plethora, I'm referring to gravel and pavement applications. Those law enforcement agencies which then use (apply) the picture that has been provided by a tainted source, can then be completely off the mark as far as who is really what, and what is really who.

One has to remember that foreign governments and their intelligence have their own agendas, and if the opportunity presents themselves will gladly skew the picture of another nation's intelligence end product. They will use hook, crook, and unknowing organizations to affect that skewing process.

I'll say again to you what I said to mark, you want to obtain/use the intelligence product from the SPLC, go right ahead your choice, I'll head in the opposite direction thank you very much.

Now pardon me while I go pull out the hairs in my head over the D.C. debacle before us.

[Adam L. Silverman]

J,

Which foreign government and which foreign intelligence service?

As for outside the bona fides of government intelligence, there are some things that are now, because of political pressures, better done or only doable outside of government. Remember DHS retracted its report on domestic, right wing extremists, which was prepared under the Bush 43 Administration and released right around the time President Obama took office, because of a collective, organized Conservative Movement freak out. Since the current Administration is too cowed to do its work, then someone either fills the niche or the entire area of focus gets ignored.

[Jackie]

Adam, I think I know which foreign government J is referring to, but I will wait until he explains it.

J, You have hair? Cool! I used to think the SPLC was okay, but I can see your point.

[euclidcreek]

In the eighties and nineties the ADL in San Francisco was revealed to have compiled information on journalists, students, anti-apartheid activist, trade unions, Arab-Americans and others. Some of this information went to the FBI, the governments of Israel, South Africa, El Salvador and the Soviet Union. A SFPD officer supplied the ADL with confidential information from the police. In 1993 the SFPD raided the office of the ADL, looking for information used in a political spy-ring. An SFPD Officer said, "this is the tip of the iceberg, this is going on nation-wide." Google for more information. Question: did the SPLC have involvement with the law enforcement actions at Waco, Ruby Ridge, and what did it know regarding Elohim City prior to the Oklahoma City bombing?

[Kieran]

"both espousing a set of beliefs that are towards the fringes of the larger societies, groups, movements, and/or subcultures that they are part of and whose beliefs are either directly used to justify violence..."

By this definition it would seem Nazism was not extremist (mainstream, not fringe). Others, say early American colonists agitating for revolution, were extremists (...?)

I am not persuaded that 'extremism' is a useful concept. Who says what the extremes are? Can not the mainstream be 'extremist'? It seems like one of those terms of political abuse (and ripe for Orwellian abuse of the English language) along the lines of, say, 'terrorism'.

[markfromireland]

Gosh, I wouldn't have thought that what passed between J and myself came under the heading of "heated". J has repeatedly made a very serious allegation against the SPLC. In response I have invited him* to substantiate the allegation or to provide a link to somebody else's work.

J has failed to do either.

Instead, J has repeated the allegations, suggested that I want to "hug up" to SPLC, tried to say that it is a statement not an accusation, and all of of this while evading any attempt to substantiate the accusation.

Then there's this:

"I am not talking academic plethora, I'm referring to gravel and pavement applications. Those law enforcement agencies which then use (apply) the picture that has been provided by a tainted source, can then be completely off the mark as far as who is really what, and what is really who."

From what I've seen of them American law enforcement agencies adopt a thoroughly practical and professional approach to the work of others be it "academic" or otherwise, they're interested in whether the work in question helps them with their "gravel and pavement" task of catching the perpetrators of crime with a view to prosecuting them in a court of law. for their crimes.

From what I've seen of them American law enforcement agencies also quickly discount accusations from people who cannot or will not back up those allegations.

I am of the opinion that J is evading any attempt to substantiate his accusations because he cannot and because he knows he cannot.

markfromireland

*I've gathered the impression from reading J's comments over time that J is male, my apologies to J if I'm wrong about that. - mfi

[J]

Adam, mark, Jackie,

The foreign government to which I am referring is the Israeli government, and their foreign intelligence service their Israeli Mossad.

mark, I have not tried to evade, and have not made an accusation, I have made a simple statement based on my own personal research coupled with lengthy discussions with both former and retired personnel who have arrived at the same conclusion based on their own research and their own conversations with others. I just simply stated that I would not and I do not trust their intelligence gathering and consider them a tainted source for domestic intelligence gathering. In 1995 I was out in the pastures working cattle when I felt the concussion of the Murrah blast. I was involved in the U.S. law enforcement sphere a few years back when U.S. law enforcement did their own domestic intelligence gathering rather than sit on their brains and take the word of outside sources like the SPLC or some corporation/business and what they say about U.S. domestic groups that become potential violent forces real quick as the intelligence gospel truth. I remember how tired and haggard some of our commissioned law enforcement intelligence personnel were after coming back from their field assignments, really haggard. Their assignments were dangerous, very dangerous and in many ways far more dangerous than narcotic agents field assignments as the people they were dealing with were always attentive and not spaced out, they were edgy not calm and 'floating'.

I simply say that today's law enforcement's decision to farm out their intelligence gathering to outside sources opens them (and our nation) up to some very dangerous unintended consequences, it opens them (and our nation as a whole) up to hostile penetration by a foreign entity with its own foreign objectives is all.

The Israeli Mossad has more times than not showed no hesitation or remorse in causing the deaths [directly/indirectly] of Americans (military/intelligence/civilians) from the mid50s on to our present time period to meet their foreign objectives.

Now that I've hopefully answered your questions to your satisfaction I'll get back to pulling out the hairs in my head as I watch the D.C. debacle continue to morph.

Adam, I never said you bantered about nilly willy, I simply requested that you establish some goal posts before going into the definition of what is, is.

Oh mark, before I forget, Beannachd Dia dhuit.

[J]

Adam,

May I draw your attention to this latest tidbit that has floated to the surface:

"TSA readying new behavior detection plan for airport checkpoints"
http://www.politico.com/blogs/joshgerstein/0711/TSA_readying_new_behavior_detection_plan_for_airport_checkpoints.html

Now my question, when will both Napolitano and Pistole get it through their noggins that this is not Israel? And that Israeli failed techniques will also fail here in our U.S. like they have and continue to do in Israel? Behavioral detection plan my hind end, pardon my French. This is nothing but a stupid word-game re-branding by Pistole of the failed Israeli originated garbage.

We are not Israel, we have a free speech and free movement here! Israel can be their little own totalatarian police state, just don't bring their Israeli garbage and Israeli restrictions onto my U.S. shores.

It's stuff like that keeps agitating our U.S. population and making them more averse to the totalitarian postage stamp known as Israel. D.C. needs to fire Napolitano and Pistole and dissolve the failed DHS and TSA boondoggles.

[Charles I]

Huh, think tanks and well heeled "experts" - remember when the government had 'em? - worked for your foreign and economic policies.

Besides, this is part of the new accountability. We all know how hard it is to bring the govt to account when they, er, make a mistake. Nonprofits are a piece of cake compared to the actual police.

The ones I agree with, of course.

[WILL]

from
http://www.cnas.org/blogs/abumuqawama/2011/07/quote-day.html

"Marc Sageman has strong words for Robert Spencer, Pamela Geller and others:

Marc Sageman, a former C.I.A. officer and a consultant on terrorism, said it would be unfair to attribute Mr. Breivik’s violence to the writers who helped shape his world view. But at the same time, he said the counterjihad writers do argue that the fundamentalist Salafi branch of Islam “is the infrastructure from which Al Qaeda emerged. Well, they and their writings are the infrastructure from which Breivik emerged.”

“This rhetoric,” he added, “is not cost-free.”"

[William R. Cumming]

The Norwegian government has promised a thorough investigation of the events around Breivik's attacks and response. Even the right wing parties have pledged to assist that effort.

Also apparently the Norwegian government and people have pledged to not be deterred by the attacks from multiculturalism and more effort to promote the notion of helping the "others" who reside in Norway or come there. Time will tell.

I would note for the record that because the legal process in the US court system is often slow various issues on immigration look as though the courts will be ruling on significant issues in the USA on immigration legal and illegal in 2012 just in time to influence the independent voters who are a majority in the USA. I am still predicting illegal immigration and its consequences will be a huge issue in the 2012 Presidential elections and still open as to whether the HISPANIC community promised reform by the President in 2008 will react to Administration inactivity. Or at least inactivity so far.

Again predicting that the BUSH/CHERTOFF proposals will be renewed and become the outline for reform efforts.

[Fred]

J

You are right, but the terrorized middle class believes this crap. Somewhere on the planet some child was 'used as a suicide bomber' (where and when is never referenced) therefore all children are suspect. Same with the 'surgically' implantable bombs BS making the rounds. This isn't 'behavior profiling' it is harassment, but don't complain or you'll be put on one of the many lists kept by TSA/DHS. . Meanwhile corporate jets - they don't get checked or screened at all.

[J]

Fred,

Pistole can take his cancer causing radiated TSA body scanners and put them where the sun doesn't shine for all I care. Pistole seems so enamored with Israeli totalitarian crap, let him move there. Oops, he just might and then they'd get some other nimnod to fill his place that might be worse that he is.

They called the Congress really need to clean up their act and retract the failed boondoggle they created called the DHS and TSA, after all what they do has nuthing to do with protecting America, it has to do with making big bucks for Chertoff and his scanner making behavioral profiling buddies. Terrorism is a BIG $$$ making business, just ask Chertoff.

[bill roche]

I would imagine that the "Sons of Liberty" were outside the mainstream of public thought in 1774 and they did advocate violence...ergo terrorists. Would you have had Irish gentry and peasants talk things over with Elizabeth's troops in 1600? You know, while the English armies laid waste to every living thing in southern Ireland. Perhaps if they did there would never have been a need for Irish secrete societies which in their latest incarnation appear to us as the IRA.
While we are making a partial list, let's not forget those awful Philippino terrorists who caused so much trouble 1n 1900. In 1944 who were the organized terrorists in Palestine...Jews or Arabs? Who are the terrorists who are acting violently there today? Are Chechan terrorists the problem in southern Russia or are we seeing the aftermath of Stalin's ethnic cleansing? Certainly the Kurds harbor terrorists and not the Turkish government which denies them autonomy. I could go on but I am sure you've got the point. One man's terrorists is another's freedom fighter. All the lofty commentary does not overtake that simple truth. Of course we have to protect ourselves from crazy violent people and groups of them...but judge not lest you be judged. Careful who we refer to as terrorists.
Billy Roche.