Admiral Olson and the Terrorists

 
"Olson agreed with the White House's newly announced policy to strike terrorists through focused action rather than full-scale invasion, preferably by training and working with the host country's forces. He cautioned against thinking raids would solve all U.S. foreign policy problems."  AP

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Admiral Olson is the commander of Special Operations Command, the multi service major command that runs all the military counterterrorist (CT) commando units and their associated intelligence activities.

The CIA has its own "thing" in this field, much smaller, but obviously better.  Just ask them or their flacks in the media.  They will be glad to tell you all about it.

Olson is not in the COIN business.  The COIN cult calls for wresting control of whole populations away from insurgents through a variety of positive and negative enducements.

Olson is in the business of killing terrorists and destroying their ability to launch raids against "point" target in the US and/or against friendly countries.  He wages an undeclared war aganst those who some group of people in the executive branch of the US government believe to be dangerous enemies.

It appears that Admiral Olson sees his mission as bounded only by executive decision as to who is a terrorist.

Does this bother anyone here other than me?  pl

http://news.yahoo.com/spec-ops-chief-warns-al-qaida-2-0-051439458.html

Comments

[Matthew]

It bothers me too, Col. Some of us still believe in Article I, Section 9: "No Bill of Attainder or ex post facto Law shall be passed." As to the terrorist U.S. citizen hiding in Yemen, he should still have access to the 5th Amendment, "No person shall be held to answer for a capital, or otherwise infamous crime, unless on presentment or indictment of Grand Jury..."

Essentially, the Founders in the their great wisdom prohibited either the President or the Congress from convicting someone of a criminal act. Clearly, the government believes the power to designate "a terrorist" now includes the power to punish said terrorist without the need to convict. This is the ultimate slippery slope. The belief becomes the justification. Whether the belief is accurate becomes immaterial.

[highlander]

I personally am a "line all the bastards up and shoot them", kind of guy.

But...when I become one of the bastards....well, that changes things.

And with the way the Federal government is, not so slowy going( and the locals take their cue from the Feds), any of us, if we get far out of line may find ourselves, in one kind of very uncomfortable line up or the other. And it won't matter a hill of beans, what your personal political preferences are.

Now, if you run a hedge fund, you probably don't have anything to fear. Since you have in effect, already purchased the Federal government's affections.

This little situation was in essence, what the "War of Northern Aggression" was all about. The South lost, and the Federal Beast won. Now we are going into the end game, some 150 years latter.

[Brad Ruble]

The Black Panthers, Waco, Randy Weaver, every kid ever busted for pot...A lot of people in this country will wonder why we are getting so upset all of a sudden.

[graywolf]

"Does this bother anyone here other than me? pl"
NO.

You have been a consistent critic of the use/misuse of COIN (correctly, IMHO) and an advocate of CT.
Aren't these comments "pure" CT?
And, to your question:
If not COIN and not CT, what then?

[Patrick Lang]

graywolf

I did not exress myself well. i have no problem with continuing the CT "war." what I am concerned with is the process of approving targets. pl

[Patrick Lang]

highlander

Roger on the "last phase" of what began then. pl

[memjfm1]

I guess I don't see your concern. Under the Unified Command Plan, the functional USSOCOM and its commander, CINCSOCOM, is subject to the orders of the national command authority. On a side note, I've known ADM Eric Olson for over 30 years.He and I served together in Egypt as one of the US officers assigned to the UN organization monitoring the early implementation of Camp David and the withdrawal of the Israelis with the Sinai reoccupation by the Egyptians. He's the real deal and as true as they come. He well understands the limits of his reach and the correct role of the military in our system.

[ex-PFC Chuck]

"Does this bother anyone here other than me? pl"

Yes.

[Tony C.]

Yes, it bothers me tremendously. As you, and many others have pointed out in recent years, it's not only the lawlessness of such activities, but the questionable efficacy.

I cannot imagine, for example, that we don't spawn multiple potential terrorists by slaughtering innocent people in "targeted" drone strikes, for every actual bad guy who is killed.

[Patrick Lang]

memjfm1

"the orders of the national command authority."

So, POTUS, in your view, should have the legal right to condemn people or groups to death as a command decision? Do you think there are any limits to that authority?

Olson may be a splendid fellow, but that is irrelevant. This is not about personalities. pl

[J]

Colonel, Nightsticker,

Olson's "ability to launch raids against "point" target in the US", has me just a wee bit 'concerned'. Isn't he overstepping and stepping on a whole lot of U.S. domestic law enforcement/judicial toes? Looks that way to me, not to mention the fact that Executive decision is 'overriding' our U.S. Constitution and its protections.

I wonder what Olsen and his boys would say if they came to a crusty U.S. Sheriff who told them to go and shove their executive decision authority where the sun doesn't shine. I can think of a few old crusty now deceased U.S. Sheriffs who would not have hesitated todo just that, but with today's crop of young Sheriff's I just don't know if they are comfortable enough in their own skins to show some moxy as guardians of our U.S. Constitution and U.S. citizenry.

[William R. Cumming]

Who are the enemies? Who are the terrorists? Those are critical questions but more importantly is who decides the answers? This is too important a series of questions to be left to the perogatives of the flag ranks collectively or individually.

[J]

Colonel,

This whole thing sounds like POTUS is having a 'King George moment' where the King is god and condemns to death or life those serfs whom he commands. Doesn't POTUS understand that our forefathers threw off the yolk of of the King George moments for our nation's posterity? It doesn't appear that way, it appears a POTUS intentional willful discarding of our U.S. Constitution and it afforded protections, which merits his immediate removal from office.

[Fred]

Graywolf,

You have been a consistent critic of the (social) policies of the USA for the entire time I've read your posts on this blog. I can only conclude you support those who are out to destroy our way of life. All it takes now is for someone within the US Government (Yes - one of 'those' guv'ment employees) to declare 'greywolf' a terrorist. Then As memjfm1 so rightly points out, "CINCSOCOM, is subject to the orders of the national command authority.", when the national command authority is told to eliminate the terrorist threat named 'greywolf' - they are going to do just that.

It is all very reminiscent of that IDF pilot who said (to paraphrase) "that ship isn't ours and it's not one of the enemy's" his 'national command authority' said 'you are ordered to attack'. He just followed orders. It was all so legal. See any of the many entries on USS Liberty. Or go back even further to the Nuremberg trials. Following orders is the thing to do!

Hope and change, how wonderfully that's working out for us.

[Bill H.]

We are increasingly moving toward an imperial governmant. The issue that bothers you, Patrick, is but one of the perogatives assumed by the executive branch as our nation is increasingly governed by executive order. This debt ceiling issue will probably create yet another as Congress refuses to lift the ceiling and provides a method for the executive to do so without them.

[memjfm1]

'So, POTUS, in your view, should have the legal right to condemn people or groups to death as a command decision? Do you think there are any limits to that authority?' Yes, there are certainly limits and limits for good reason. But my reservations are much less for non-US citizens who are not afforded Constitutional protections. In fact, make that certain select offshore US citizens who abrogate their rights by violent direct actions against us. Again, it sounds cavalier and maybe trivializing the gravity of the undertaken, but the few characters who would come under the extraordinary findings, by my count, have no rights and do not deserve 'due process' or some time consuming legal vetting. I recently retired from a decade largely in counter terrorism policy at the national level here in DC. I’ve likely heard most like arguments for restraint in these matters, and seen both sides of the outcome. Now that I am unfettered by my former employ, I am more in tune with my true disposition...there are some fights we better eschew the Marquess of Queensberry rules, remove the gloves and go after the bastards hard if we’re serious about protecting ourselves. Again, is this a wholesale license for the Executive Branch to conduct unaccountable mayhem overseas with our special instruments, decidedly no. Should we have that arrow, as I understand it that you resist, in our quiver? You betcha!

[ked]

Bothers these guys too. I doubt much will come of it. Group-think momentum, fear, careerism & secrecy are all the rage in the US National Security state.

“It is critical that officials of the United States not secretly reinterpret public laws in a manner that is inconsistent with the public’s understanding of such laws, and not describe the execution of such laws in a way that misinforms or misleads the public.”

http://www.wired.com/dangerroom/2011/07/bill-would-force-intel-chief-to-rebuke-secret-patriot-act/#more-53418

My own take-away is an axiom... "the sign that a nation is not a democracy is the extent to which the rights of those implementing laws & policies supercede the rights of the polity."

[jr786]

We're an empire. The Emperor/Dictator has the power to proscribe his/our enemies in much the same way that Sulla did. Right now their foreigners, but precedents have to start somewhere. If Olson's people end up killing Anwar al-Awlaki then we'd be one step closer to Rome.

[Patrick Lang]

memjfm1

"there are certainly limits and limits for good reason."

What are the limits? pl

[Sidney O. Smith III]

Fred and anyone so inclined:

Ken Halliwell recently posted an essay on the testimony of Iftach (or Yiftak) Spector– the lead attack pilot on the USS Liberty.

http://sites.google.com/site/usslibertyinquiry/essay28

Only takes a few minutes to read. Each can draw his or her own conclusions.

[Fred]

memjfm1
"But my reservations are much less for non-US citizens who are not afforded Constitutional protections."

Can I see your birth certificate? Sound familiar?

"there are certainly limits and limits for good reason."

You are right, the necessary limit is ALL who are within the power of the US Government are accorded Constitutional protection. While the only good terrorist is a dead one, just having some 'evidence' doesn't make an accusation a fact. Sadly we've killed lots who were innocent and thus created far more who now are capable of becoming threats to the US.

To quote the article about that great guy Admiral Olsen:

" Olson said the group had already lost steam because of the revolts of the Arab Spring, which proved the Muslim world did not need al-Qaida to bring down governments, from Tunisia to Egypt."

So the Arab people in seeking a reform of their own governments in their own countries are the same as Al Qaida? Do you really need me to tell you what is wrong with that viewpoint? If I am wrong in my perception then this other bright spot points out the need to not replace a 38 year 'inside the box' thinker with another just like him to lead CINCSOCOM:

"The Special Operations Command has nearly doubled in size since the attacks, from 32,000 to some 60,000, including units like SEALs, Army Special Forces Green Berets and Rangers, and Marine Special Operators..."

"Olson said the fight against all versions of al-Qaida could keep U.S. special operations troops deploying at the same pace for another decade…"
The USSR is gone and now to keep the this monolithic feifdom in operation we need to proclaim the threat of 'Al Qaida 2.0'? I say no, it's time to find new leadership.

[memjfm1]

Pat and Fred, I concede to many of your points and am left to ponder what can be done using the traditional military instrument (even coupled with the right mix of diplomatic initiative and economic incentives) to contain effectively this persistent threat. As point of note, I’m here only concerned with the issue of foreign originated terrorism. Rather than specifically elaborate the limits of military power, I jump to the end of my mental staff study and conclude that because we have these restrictions, we can probably at best only contain, disrupt or temporarily deter an offshore enemy who labors under no such limits and wants us all dead. I understand that unintended collateral damage may spawn future adversaries, but in my shortsighted view of the world, I’m more intent on whacking the now bad guys than down the road 20 years. It’s truly unfortunate that innocents often die when Olson’s troops act; such is war. The military is a blunt instrument even with the best Special Forces. I fought under restrictive ROEs 40 years ago. We took hits we didn’t have to take. .. And to what avail. Don’t want to injure innocents, then don’t send the military. It’s a whole lot better than it was during the hard days of WW2. Cut to the chase; one way possibly to mitigate the folks out there who’d do us harm is to fundamentally recalibrate our relationship with Israel. This is probably not possible. Fred, I do disagree with your notion that Olson has somehow been in the business of wickering the threat to perpetuate nee growing his fiefdom. Obviously my inhibitions are less than many here. I have greater trust and confidence in our civilian masters and the moral compass of our military leadership. I think this nation has been remarkably restrained in what it could have done in the efforts to defeat foreign terrorism directed against us and our allies had our true unfettered might been loosed.

[JustPlainDave]

Seems to me that the more interesting element here is the emphasis on some form of FID+. Fraught with implications, but certainly welcome given the extent to which DA has seemed to consume all of the attention over past years.

[highlander]

I was drinking a little single malt with a few retired federal law enforcement types one evening(all good guys).

In my usual diplomatic manner,I brought up the rather unpleasant manner in which the FBI immolated by fire, SIXTY(60) children and their mothers at Waco.(Forget their incenerated men folk.....they were mostly white guys, and white males are now considered by the elites, to be entirely expendable eunuchs for the most part).

The retired FED guys said, actually, the people who drove the tanks and flame throwers were US Army DELTA guys from Bragg.

So I asked a guy at Bragg, in a position to know of such things. He just averted his gaze from mine, and said,"He really couldn't comment on such things". That gave me the answer, I didn't really want to hear.

Think about it people, the elite of the elite of the US ARMED forces, killed 100 or so men,women, and children(All US Citizens, granted they were a little nutty, but when did that become punishable by death?)) on national TV! While we the citizentry and media, looked on,"slack jawed and blank eyed",and did and said nothing.

Some good military guy, just like Admiral Olson, had to issue that order, legal or not, which, murdered those AMERICAN children and their mommys.

So you are damn right! We better be concerned about just exactly who can Admiral Olson decide to rub out, it might end up being me or you, Colonel!

[Arun]

It bothers me!

We need checks and balances on how people get on to a target list. What they should be is beyond me.