More on the Saudi arms sale...

 "Israeli concerns about the newest deal have been reportedly calmed by assurances that the jets will lack long-range weapons systems and be of a lower grade than those sold to Israel. Defense Minister Ehud Barak has reportedly discussed the deal with US officials and a US Defense Department official told Reuters that Israel is "fairly comfortable" with it overall. "  CS Monitor

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Ratigan was pretty quiet about this today.  Apparently he had not "gotten the word."  He left it to his new "Robin," Cenk Uighur, (apparently some sort of left wing Turk type) to bash the Saudis, thereafter vaguely mumbling his approval.

I did not much like living in SA.  They are, in many ways, insufferable in their arrogance and thinly veiled disdain for everyone else.

Nevertheless, one should contemplate what a replacement country would be like in that particular space on the map.  Do we imagine that the new country would be some sort of liberal Islamic republic ruled by democratic Shia and Sunni secularists?  If we imagine that we are even bigger fools than the Ziocons who still think that has been the outcome in Iraq.

The US and SA align themselves more or less on parallel courses in the ME because the two countries have quite a few parallel interests, even though in many ways their philosophies are at odds.  The same thing is true of Pakistan and the US, as well as quite a few other places.  

And, we need the money.  pl 

http://www.csmonitor.com/World/Global-News/2010/0914/Why-60-billion-in-US-arms-to-Saudi-Arabia-isn-t-causing-an-outcry/(page)/2

Comments

[From Canada]

Col. Lang,

I would love to read some of your anecdotes about living in SA. How long did you live there?

[JohnH]

Any relationship to the ME peace talks here? Israel "not concerned" because they realize the deal buys Saudi connivance with whatever scheme is being concocted?

[Patrick Lang]

FC

Three years, oh son of the sands. pl

[BillWade]

"Israel is "fairly comfortable" with it overall. "

I think that means we, the USA, got suckered again.

[eakens]

no long-range weapons system? What does that mean, they can't reach Israel?

$60B for weapons which can't reach Israel? WTF

[Cato the Censor]

Cenk Uigur is Turkish-American.

[Patrick Lang]

Cato

Bless him. pl

[Jackie]

Col.,
You've got me hooked on Ian Masters Daily Briefing on KPFK.

[William R. Cumming]

Is the Saudi relationship more important to the US than any other country but Israel?
Are there Israeli/Saudi secret protocols?
Has the US de facto guaranteed Saudi survival after Desert Storm? There are almost 30 million people now living withing Saudi borders! What demographic breakdown is know? How many are citizens? Can anyone not a follower of the Wahabi Sect of Islam rise to power in Saudi Arabia?

[confusedponderer]

Re: Cenk Uigur. He is from the site www.theyoungturks.com. Which, considering his background, is IMO a nice choice of words: Young Turks:

The term Young Turks referred to the members of the Ottoman society who were progressive, modernist and opposed to the status quo.

[ghoti]

Colonel,

How does it affect the deal for it to be stated publicly that the weapons SA is buying are less capable than those Israel gets? I remember some sort of stink a few years ago when they bought bombs from us that were less capable than those donated to Israel. Putting myself in their shoes, there would be a point that I would go elsewhere for my weapons after being given second fiddle more than once, but then there are other factors I may not being considering such as quality of U.S. weapons vs other weapons, other strategic points, etc.

[F]

"90 Billion worth of weapons & 90 'legitimate' heirs to the throne: Looks like fun times ahead!"

[Patrick Lang]

F

Don't forget the "groupies." pl

[Patrick Lang]

ghoti

On the one hand, the Arabs are more or less resigned to being treated as second class friends. At the same time, the commercial aspects of this are overwhelming. pl

[Kunuri]

Sayin Albayim,
Would Cenk Uygur be more accaptable to you if he was some sort of right wing, or independent Turk type? Anyway, you are correct, he is a Turk, and that is better in my opinion than him being Turk-ish.

[Patrick Lang]

Kunuri

Yes it would be. I like Turks of the hard core Kemalist variety. Izmir was great when we lived there. I understand that it is too big now. pl

[SD]

Sounds like the Wahabis need a Kemalist.

Maybe in the next 90 years.

[Norbert N, Salamon]

Is in not sad that once a great industrial nation has to beg [and use corruption] a satrap to bail out her dying economy by buying overpriced, second rate and almost totally useless to the buyer, armaments?

[Patrick Lang]

NSS

"second rate?" The product improved "Strike Eagle?" you should stick to something you understand. pl

[The beaver]

Colonel

I doubt the "young Turk" is a leftie. He is a former Republican .
Something for you:
http://www.sfgate.com/cgi-bin/blogs/mlasalle/detail?entry_id=19197

[Norbert N, Salamon]

Colonel:

Are they better or worse planes then that provided to Israel, including electronics, physical capabilities, armaments, etc?

[Patrick Lang]

NSS

Basilisk can tell us. pl

[confusedponderer]

NSS,
they are probably inferior to the Israeli planes, in terms of radar performance and data-linking and electronic warfare capabilities. With Derby and the latest Python the Israelis will probably have better air-to-air missiles as well.

I write this assessment based on my deep expertise gained from reading aviation journals since my teens :)

[Basilisk]

The F-15S (Saudi version of the US F-15E two seat ground attack variant) is a full brother to the F-15I (the Israeli version of the same airplane). Both are highly capable attack aircraft. Both lack some bells and whistles that come only on the "real" F-15E. As far as "almost totally useless?" You've got to be kidding.

[Norbert N, Salamon]

Basilisk:

Sorry I was not clear, my intention was to criticize the purchase with rerspecct to useless, as Saudis do not need another 50-100 war planes, as they have over 650 already, and Iran has less then 100 very old ones. This purchase is a sop to the military industrial cohort of USA. Were the planes better armed than the Israeli ones, AIPAC would force cancellation [remember the 100 million deal to Lebanon?].

Aside thanks to confusedponderer and you, Sir, for clarifying the planes capabilities.