Open Thread - 12 July, 2010

 

Comments

[Ken Roberts]

"On The Make" is a brief description of much of the behaviour which people here find offensive - various manners of selling out, instead of tending to the group goals for which one was trained in, or selected for, or entrusted with.

OTM behaviour may be a high risk area, ie non-OTM behaviour may be a centre of gravity.

So ... how to encourage non-OTM activity? That's my suggestion for an open thread topic.

kr

ps. I like the image used for "open thread". I recently read an article about how to make rope, and fooled around with rope-making at home. It involves the individual strands being twisted one way, while the whole group is twisted the other way, creating a rope which does not stretch or kink. There is some sort of social structure analogue.

[N M Salamon]

something ids wrong with the USA:
Discretionary budgets in $ (billions) and percentages Year Total ($) Defense ($) Defense (%) Education ($) Education (%) Health ($) Health (%)
Sources and notes
•The link for each year takes you to that year’s source
•The defense budget is only the Pentagon request each Fiscal Year. It does not include nuclear weapons programs from the Department of Energy, or funding for wars such as Iraq and Afghanistan.

2009 997 541 54 61.9 6.2 52.7 5.3
2008 930 481.4 51.8 58.6 6.3 52.3 5.6
2007 873 460 52.7 56.8 6.5 53.1 6.1
2006 840.5 438.8 52 58.4 6.9 51 6.1
2005 820 421 51 60 7 51 6.2
2004 782 399 51 55 7 49 6.3
2003 767 396 51.6 52 6.8 49
more % for Defense less for education and health!

[J]

Colonel,

Bibi leaving the White House with a 'smile on his face' scares the beejeez out of me. Bibi with a smile is not a good omen for U.S..

[par4]

I thought the thumbnails resembled a nautical motif. It adds a touch of inter-service camaraderie.

[Recondo]

As we used to say in the Navy, "knot training is good training." Then we went and painted stuff.

[LeaNder]

‘CNN’ gives platform to latest neocon astroturf war-with-Iran group

http://mondoweiss.net/2010/07/cnn-gives-platform-to-latest-neocon-astroturf-war-with-iran-group.html

[Fred]

NSM,

health and education have been politically labelled 'entitlement' programs, which citizens aren't entiteled too. Besides, one can never spend too much on 'defence'. Maybe we should change the DOD back to the War Department; afterall we haven't won a war since we made the change.

[Fred]

Here's an interesting bit from our 2nd president:

http://teachingamericanhistory.org/library/index.asp?document=37

Curiously I have his 'Disertaion on the Cannon and Fuedal Law' bookmarked.

[Nancy K]

I think that at some point the American people will wake up and decide they don't want a foreign country, wall street, oil companies, and other such lobbies deciding our future. The teabaggers are not the American people, they are a small mean spirited group, who don't mind receiving social benefits, ie Social Security and MediCare, but God forbid anyone else receive them.
I am sick of war, sick of our educational system being one of the worst of the industrialized nations, sick of our infrastructure following apart, sick of the lack of affordable health care, and sick of the S---eating grins on both Republican and Democratic politicians as they all take money from the above mentioned lobbies.
These are my thought for the day.

[William R. Cumming]

Almost getting funny watching BP spin while searching for asset buyers who might also acquire some of the liability portfolio.

Wondering what the various pension plans heavily invested in BP will be doing to protect that investment?

[J]

WRC,

Don't forget all the rumblings that Obama because of his personal investment portfolio in Exxon-Mobil stands to make at least $85 Million from the Gulf disaster, as it's been forecast that Exxon will eventually acquire BP at fire-sale prices.

Course he's not alone, his predecessor GWB made at a minimum $40 Million when the price of crude went through the roof to $140 plus a barrel.

Presidents/Vice Presidents should not be allowed to make a profit at the expense of their nation and fellow citizens experiencing a calamity. Something is just not right with that picture.

We need to 're-write the rules' regarding the Presidency/Vice Presidency, just like we need to 're-write the rules' regarding what Members of Congress can and cannot do (live in a dorm, no more expense perks, etc.).

[Patrick Lang]

zanzibar

thanks. pl

[Jackie]

I'm picking up creepy vibes that this country is once again sleepwalking to war with another country in the ME on behalf of a small client state. Please, someone tell me I'm wrong and that saner heads will prevail. After Iraq, I'm not so sure

[J]

Professor John J. Mearsheimer on Israel’s Nukes, Espionage and its Impact on the U.S.

Video:

http://vimeo.com/13162351

Transcript:

http://original.antiwar.com/john-mearsheimer/2010/07/08/israels-nukes-harm-us-national-interests/

[different clue]

Sidney O. Smith III,

Many threads ago I remember reading that you are interested in the Mystic component or sector of religious faith and experience. I know nothing about Mysticism as a religious approach or discipline; but I have about receptivity to mystic experience and the acceptance of a mystic sensibility in the pursuit of scientific research by a scientist who has written semi-extensively about accepting mystic awareness in his own scientific work.
I wonder whether an understanding of the mystic sensibility in science might prepare one to know when one is percieving from within a mystic sensibility in religion.

In case that might be so...I thought I would in briefest describe the scientist I have in mind; and a few of his books. First I will copy a little professional biography copied off of Amazon...if Colonel Lang okays it.
"About the Author
Dr. Philip S. Callahan is a philosopher as well as a top-grade scientist. An internationally famous entomologist and ornithologist, he has been responsible for breakthrough discoveries in both areas. He is also an explorer who has walked across mainland China and the Syrian Desert, observing the intricate ways of man and nature wherever he went.
He entered the U.S. Army Air Force in 1942, and served two years in the European Theater of Operations during World War II. Hiking around the world after he war, he worked as a freelance photographer and writer. Later, he attended Fordham University and received his B.A. and M.S. degrees from the University of Arkansas and his Ph.D. from Kansas State University. He served as assistant professor of the Entomology Department at Louisiana State University and later joined the U.S. Department of Agriculture, Southern Grain Insects Research Laboratory as Project Leader for Insect Biophysics. He was also Professor of Entomology on the graduate faculty of the University of Georgia. In 1969 he transferred to USDA Insect Attractant and Behavior Laboratory at Gainesville, Florida. Callahan served as a full professor on the graduate faculty of the University of Florida, and on the staff of The Olive W. Garvey Center for the Improvement of Human Functioning, Inc. as an infrared systems and low energy consultant.

His research involved the utilization of nonlinear far infrared radiation by biological systems and its applications to insect control and medicine. He has developed theories of insect communication based on the waveguide characteristics of insect spines and has postulated that such spines are thermoelectret-coated dielectric waveguide aerials with the ability to receive short wavelength IR and microwave frequencies. His work in biophysics might best be called studies in insect molecular bioelectronics.

He is the author of more than 100 scientific papers and numerous books, including: My Search for Traces of God; A Walk in the Sun; Nature's Silent Music; Ancient Mysteries, Modern Visions; Tuning in to Nature; and, Paramagnetism. "

In a few of his books he overtly describes his mystical sensibility as he understands it to be, and says how that directed his vision towards the science he has been able to do.

A Walk In The Sun,
http://www.acresusa.com/books/closeup.asp?prodid=54&catid=27&pcid=2

My Search For The Traces Of God,
http://www.acresusa.com/books/closeup.asp?action=related&prodid=51&pcid=2

Nature's Silent Music,
http://www.acresusa.com/books/closeup.asp?prodid=52&catid=27&pcid=2

and...Ancient Mysteries, Modern Visions ( The Magnetic Life of Agriculture),
http://www.acresusa.com/books/closeup.asp?action=related&prodid=66&pcid=2

My Search For The Traces Of God is the only one of these books where he overtly links mystic perception with religious faith. The others describe mystic sensitivity in scientific pursuit; as well as the science itself. Still, if understanding the mystic vision in one area allows one to percieve mysticality well enough to be able to recognize the direct perception of it in other areas; then these books might be useful.

[dagezhu]

http://www.legitgov.org/Bomb-Explodes-Oil-Executives-Home

It looks like 4GW can happen in the USA.

10 Jul 2010 Local and federal investigators were at a northwest Houston home Friday night where an explosion sent a woman to the hospital. The woman was opening a package left at her doorstep in the 2100 block of Seamist Court Friday evening. Officials with the Alcohol, Tobacco and Firearms, as well as the Houston Police Department's homicide and bomb squad were at the scene investigating. It wasn't immediately clear whether the house was targeted, however, Eyewitness News found out the home is owned by an oil company executive.

[confusedponderer]

After having thought it over I would recommend to you the entire "Reilly Ace of Spies." TV series. Conan Doyle is good too. I suggest the "Mystery of the Great Sumatran Rat." And then there are always the early LeCarre stories.

I really liked "Reilly - Ace of Spies". And there was a time in my life when I knew my Conan Doyle by heart. Still, I think that John Buchan's Richard Hannay is sorely missing in your count. And, of course, and Rudyard Kipling's Kim.

[Sidney O. Smith III]

DC

Thank you very much for taking the time to reference the works of Philip Callahan. Prior to you post, I had never heard of him. I researched (aka googled) his name and read a little about him. His life does pique my interest and time permitting, I would like to read at least one of his books.

I can’t quite recall comments in which I emphasized the “mystical”. But, in a nutshell, I do believe in this day and age, properly developed intuition can play a key role in understanding and perceiving, if you will, the environment. But, imo, such an aptitude can only arise from mastery of the facts. Moreover, intuitive conclusions, by and large, must make sense logically. Only then can one see patterns and trends not noticeable before. And only then can one make heretofore unknown creative associations.

A rough analogy. A musician first learns all the fundamentals of music theory as well as technique and then begins to a create different arrangements never before heard. The great ones can usher a new reality, I suppose.

The “ancients” may have called this wisdom, but who knows…

Keeping in mind that I know absolutely nothing about Callahan except what was gleaned from a few minutes of research, one gets the feeling that Callahan took such an approach. And I would think mastery of any particular scientific field can lead to intuitive insights.

But, imo, a lethal danger looms for those who emphasize the mystical at the expense of all else. To plug this idea into this work at SST and “strategic intel analysis”, an overemphasis of the mystical can lead to what Sherman Kent called strategic intel that “takes off from the wish” that, in turn, leads to a detachment from reality. Kent illustrated this danger by pointing to Hitler’s approach to stratetic intel analysis but a present day example are the neoconservatives, as Habakkuk clearly demonstrated in one of his essays.

And logically speaking, after reading General Ali’s essay, one can say this same principle applies to Patreaus, the Pentagon, and the entire USG. So it looks like our Afghanistan policy, not to mention our entire approach to the Middle East, is a prime example of that which Sherman Kent warned -- taking off from an ideological wish. If so, odds increase that ruin will come our way.

Again, many thanks for the reference. I look forward to learning more about P. Callahan.

Sid

[optimax]

s.o.s.III,
I believe it was Aristotle who warned of the "tyranny of the mind." The same warning needs to be applied to intuition. The term "counter-intuitive" seems like an empty term to me. Aristotle seems to be seeking balance between reason and intuition, for one without the other is tyranny.

What you call wisdom is what the Greeks and Romans called the Muse or Genius. And begins with mimicry--the recitation of a poem or song that becomes an imitation of style and finally a unique style. I may be wrong but believe modern education has dropped mimicry, or rote learning, as an important educational tool.

[Sidney O. Smith III]

Optimax (from Oregon, right?)

I appreciate your taking the time to share the insight. What you write makes great sense to me, now that I have had the chance to think about it. Reason and Intuition and a touch of a Muse. Maybe that was what Sherman Kent was writing about, after all.

I have a recollection -- perhaps erroneous -- that not only do you live in Oregon but also you have worked with trains, one way or the other.

Oregon and Trains. Reason and Intuition. If true, then, as far as I am concerned, you have discovered the secret to a great life.

Sid

[optimax]

Sidney,

You have a good memory. But what keeps me sane isn't a secret but walking with my dog in the woods at least once a day. My Golden/Lab keeps black moods at bay.

Col., We met a Norwich Terrier at the park yesterday. He was a friendly little feisty guy. I hope yours is recovering well.

[different clue]

Sidney Smith,

(and if I should use the fullest form please let me know and I will go right back to it...)

If one were to read only one of Phillip Callahan's books, Ancient Mysteries Modern Visions (the Magnetic Life of Agriculture) might be the single best one to read. He guides the reader through
large amounts of logically assembled fact and knowledge, and vision guided
by that fact and knowledge. It shows some of what he knows, how he knows it, and how and what he thinks about it. I believe he also
doesn't select wished-for facts to advance a pre-selected vision.

I referrenced Phillip Callahan because I thought I had remembered your having written in the past about a mystic component to Rabbi Yoel Teitlebaum's religious philosophy and perception, and also an interest in the Eastern Orthodox Church. But I might be remembering that out of my own imagination. My brain sometimes plays tricks on me that way.

Regardless, I think that book may prove interesting and I hope any time spent on it does not turn out to be time lost. (People already interested in agriculture/horticulture/agronomy may find all his books interesting, I think.)

[Sidney O. Smith III]

DC

Because of what you write, I am going to read some Callahan. Thanks for letting me know about him.

You are exactly right about what I have written re: Rabbi Teitelbaum and the Greek Orthodox Church. Like optimax wrote above, you have a good memory. So I stand corrected because I believe I did use the word mystic (and, hopefully, moral giant) to describe Rabbi J. Teitelbaum. Teitelbaum, at least to me, comes across as a man of ritual and compassion and before it is over with, he may have fulfilled some kind of prophetic office, at least when it comes to Zionism.

Awhile back, I came to the conclusion, for better or for worse, that ritual, if approached properly, can put certain people on the path to very accurate intuitive insights or something akin. Much of this started when I stumbled years ago upon a rambling, albeit fascinating, essay by Carl Jung titled, “Transformation Symbolism of Mass” or some such. At the time, I was not religious in the least. And, today, I am not Jungian but I do like how he continually emphasized that religion means “linking to”, which for him, meant linking to the collective unconscious in such a way that it will inform what he calls “the ego-consciousness”.

Rabbi Teitelbaum was one of the first to see the catastrophe that lies over the horizon, to the point that it is laughable, in a tragic sort of way, when you contrast the accuracy of the analytical assumptions that arise out of his worldview to those assumptions applied by the intel analysts currently working in the USG, at least from what I can tell. A man among children, particularly when you contrast him to the neoconservatives. The accuracy of his assumptions prove it. History may as well.

Re: Greek Orthodox or Eastern Orthodox. I know very little about Igor Stravinsky but, from what I can tell, his creative genius is interwoven with his Orthodox faith.

I go by “Sid”. I only starting using my full name when I decided to take a stand on the USS Liberty, for better or for worse (I don't know which).

You really have piqued my interest in Callahan. I will let you know.

Again thanks,

Sid

[Charles I]

Wow, Different Clue, that is very cool stuff.

Sidney, I believe we were also discussing Rothko and this led to mysticism, theme of the anguished mystic, the work beyond the more phantasmagorical elements of the journey to get to that, it seems to me in Rothko, that singularly bleak and incomprehensible void at the edge of our consciousness or physicality that we seem to hope or imagine
penetration of or integration with will resolve us, unite us, complete us, or in my case, delight us.

I just came down from the cottage so I could drive into a different quieter bush to go on a mega mushroom weekend with 3 of my dearest. . . and we shall truly practice Ritual with more reverence than I could ever assemble in church or courtroom..

I can say that for me this is no longer much about the mystical aspects of these excursions, which as a lad were central to me. I recall musing that the mystical has revealed itself, to me and mine, in these settings as the perfectly natural manifestation of the void that contains our source, and, presumably, some sign of our Creator.

I recall discussing Rothko seeming to me to wish to go inward, toward the dark lonely point we all physically terminate in, to get beyond to the heart and soul of the matter. I discovered I was going outward, towards Creation, and these bits of Creation, and the sensations they impart to me on these bucolic occasions inform the totality of my eschatology. I assure you during these times that I and my fellows are jointly and directly linked to a collective unconsciousness that did indeed inform my ego-conciousness in a way no other collective worship, or any other parts of my life, for that matter, ever has. It must be what I imagine religious faith is, sentience subsumed in spirit experienced as subject and object.

Or else we're out there have folie a quatres. Either way, it is informing, invigorating, humbling and reviving all in one. It is as beautiful as life and death, indeed, that's all, here, there is. Lucky for me I was shown this, because as a clever manic depressive drug addict armed with a law degree

The collective unconciousness I seek is not human per se, too limited, there's something waaaaaay bigger out/in there, it made me a way better human being w/r/t to ALL of Creation, pavement, people and all.

When's the last time you really saw the stars, its impossible from urban areas, but out there in the woods, you are reminded of where and what you are. And you can connect yourself, not only to yourself, and your fellows, but to the stars.

Which science has recently told us we are in fact, composed of.

So it seems my mysticism has taken a decidedly materialistic turn all along. . . .

I've been at the webless cottage for three weeks, going right back for five more after church, and trying to digest this site is one of my top priorities during these dips into the city.

You guys, as usual, are collectively, consciously, incredible, informative, provocative, indignant about the GOI, generous in time and spirit.

Did we, er, you, decide whether we start to pay or subscribe yet?

[different clue]

Charles,

At the risk of seeming awfully bookish...your comment has brought to mind an author some of whose books you might enjoy depending on how deeply interested you are in mushrooms, fungus, and so on. He is a mycologist named Paul Stamets who lives and works in coastal Oregon I believe. A book of his in which he applies his interest and knowledge of mushrooms/fungi to all of life is called Mycelium Running: How Mushrooms Can Help Save The World. (An ambitious belief to be sure. But he seems to make a good case for it). Here is a link...
http://www.fungi.com/books/stamets.html

Ken Roberts,

If we are going to figure out how to counter on-the-make behavior; we may first have to come up with an accurate name for its opposite. Perhaps on-the-up-and-up might be such a name. Perhaps other good or better names might be found.

If such behavior can be codified and rendered describable to any literate thought-capable person; then
we can think about how the on-the-up-and-up community might take defensive measures to render its members resistant to the effects of on-the-make people. If we can do that, we can then perhaps go further and use our fortified on-the-up-and-up communities as bases from which to actively attack and undermine the perpetrators and centers of on-the-make behavior.

Perhaps some of the baldest on-the-make behaviors can be legislatively or regulatorily suppressed in fact as against merely in theory; but counter-OnTheMakeness will also have to be enculturated and behaviorally pursued before or without legislative and/or regulatory support.

Perhaps we will have to search ourselves for signs of defensive on-the-makeness
and decide not to be defensively on-the-make our own selves. For example, many honest people try to "keep ahead of inflation" without meaning to hurt anyone else. But it occured to me at some point that the only way someone can keep ahead of inflation is by putting someone else behind inflation. So trying to keep ahead of inflation is a kind of defensive on-the-makeness. Perhaps an on-the-up-and-up to managing one's own personal economic survival against a backdrop of inflation would be trying to keep exactly up with inflation..neither ahead of it nor behind it. That is just a tentative example.