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31 October 2009


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I bet they will find that path the day after the USA does. 'Till then, probably not.

R Whitman

This does not fit the classic definition of anti-semitism, however, it is interesting that it was published in the Jerusalem Post.

I cannot imagine it being published in the main stream media in the United States.


"He who hunts monsters should beware of becoming one himself..." — Friedrich Wilhelm Nietzsche

mac nayeri

I have nothing but respect for this gentleman.


Interesting Strands that weave a rope by non-conforming Israelis. ? anti-Semites- ? “self-hating Jews”

First, the Exodus, the first temple, the Kingdoms of David & Soloman are Myths. Propaganda put up by King Josiah to aid his move into Samaria upon the implosion of the Assyrian Empire?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Bible_Unearthed /> The Bible Unearthed: Archaeology's New Vision of Ancient Israel and the Origin of Its Sacred Texts Israel Finklestein

Second, there was no mass Expulsion from Palestine of the Jewish people by the Romans. Another Myth. Shades of Arthur Koestler’s 13th tribe (Kahazars) origin of European Jewry?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Shlomo_Sand /> Shlomo Sand Israeli Professor autho of The_Invention_of_the_Jewish_People

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Invention_of_the_Jewish_People /> The_Invention_of_the_Jewish_People

Third, Who really are the Palestinians? People are easily confused by the term Arab which is a cultural term and Arabian which is racial.

The Ancient Jews weren’t exiled by the Romans. So much myth making. Their descendants that converted to Christianity and Islam are the modern Palestinians?

http://www.jpost.com/servlet/Satellite?cid=1249418656478&pagename=JPArticle/ShowFull /> The lost Palestinian Jews By DAVID SHAMAH Jerusalem Post


Maybe a "self hating Jew"? I've read the definition of semite and it would encompass alot of folks and not just Jews, but they seem to like it best.

I have always wondered why the Palestinians had to pay the terrible price for what the Germans did. It would have been more appropriate for some place in Europe to be a Jewish refuge.

The Israelis are not helpless any more. They are doing to others, what was done to them.

Babak Makkinejad

Is Mr. Defner an American or an Israeli citizen?

To which state does he owe his allegience?

Does any one know?


the Israeli press is so much more brutal than the docile MSM American press

from Haaretz via the friday-lunch-club-blog

"Before no other country on the planet does the United States kneel and plead like this. In other trouble spots, America takes a different tone.

"It bombs in Afghanistan, invades Iraq and threatens sanctions against Iran and North Korea. Did anyone in Washington consider begging Saddam Hussein to withdraw from occupied territory in Kuwait?

"But Israel the occupier, the stubborn contrarian that continues to mock America and the world by building settlements and abusing the Palestinians, receives different treatment. Another massage to the national ego in one video, more embarrassing praise in another.

"Now is the time to say to the United States: Enough flattery. If you don't change the tone, nothing will change. As long as Israel feels the United States is in its pocket, and that America's automatic veto will save it from condemnations and sanctions, that it will receive massive aid unconditionally, and that it can continue waging punitive, lethal campaigns without a word from Washington, killing, destroying and imprisoning without the world's policeman making a sound, it will continue in its ways."

http://www.haaretz.com/hasen/spages/1124928.html />
America, stop sucking up to Israel By Gideon Levy

Sidney O. Smith III

Echoes of the courageous Avraham Burg -- former speaker of the Knesset and a man who has described an inspiring form of Zionism. Of course, last I had read, Burg had left Israel and now lives in France.

And just wait until someone like Caroline Glick gets a hold of Derfner’s screed. Derfner won’t know what hit him.

Ms. Glick is a talented writer. And the importance of Ms. Glick is this: she acts as a mediatrix to the mindset of the militant ethnic nationalism that springs out of Likud Zionism, therefore revealing much of the dynamic at work. Her JP essays, in a unique way, are a fascinating read.



Some dude I know suggested movin' the entire jewish population of israel to America & most of 'em problems be'd solved. Feasible?


Maybe to Utah, since the Mormons are fond of converting Jews after their death.

I don't know if it is feasible, but I wish the Israelis would grow up and take responsibility for their actions.

William R. Cumming

I frequently read JP to get Israeli take on events. Something interesting about this post and assume that JP is MSM in that nation-state, but maybe not! Maybe just house organ--leaving to readers to decide which organ is playing. After the end of WWII and full realization of the success of the HOLOCAUST began to sink in for those not directly involved, including Jew, Gentile, Christian, and Moslem it was clear to almost everyone that there were two choices. Live in a pluralistic secular society --like the US--or choose to populate the geographic area called Israel! The latter not being a nation until UN recongnition and US recognition in 1948! What is interesting to me even with population augmentation from the former states of the Soviet Union, Israelis today still have the same choice. Either might end badly but 60 years on the choice remains. What is the most rationale, sensible choice for an Israeli? Apparently,my anscestors (Scots)came to the British colony of Canada post US revolution to avoid fighting English wars and cheap land, and to the US directly post-enclosure laws in Wales in the 1840's when it was clear that to the English sheep were more valuable than people, and that is my history. So each Israeli can continue to decide to live in a religious state, perhaps a Sparta, or live in a pluralistic society. History will force a choice and hard to tell what each individuals choice will be for Israelis. Migrations are a key to the 21st Century and its outcomes whether propelled by political issues, economic issues, or ethnic cleansing. But at this point except for the US does not appear that any multilateral organization exists that could prevent or even modify the migrations of this century. It is not really a choice for freedom but for simple survival. Note that today the largest movement of peoples anywhere are internal or external to a nation state are the HAN Chinese.



Are you out of your mind pretending there is a difference between Israel and the U.S, ?

Well in the latest round of Arab/Israel peace talks, seems that Netanyahu is dictating what the Americans must insist on. NO PRECONDITIONS! No to settlements freeze. And the Chorus, Clinton and co, think that Netanyahu had come up with a brilliant idea, as brilliant as the brilliantine I use on my hair !!

American Empire Ghost Dance

I must second a comment I read recently at another site where someone said that they were 70 years old(I'm 67) and could not remember a day where there was not media attention paid to Israel or a Mid-East story that related to them.They seem to have have become the most important country and people on this earth!

Babak Makkinejad


I am just trying to understand what the referent of the word "we" is in the quoated text and its relationship to this person's citizenship.

The beaver

He is a good one . If one has time, just check this site:

you will be edified. I like his style of writing btw.


My understanding is that between 11 and 17 million civilians were murdered by the Nazis. The atrocities were so widespread that we'll be re-figuring the number of victims for a-hundred years. It is nationalism that makes the Jewish people mourn for their own but not include the other 5 to 11 million in their definition of holocaust. I can understand that-- as an American the number 50 thousand soldiers killed reoccurs. The problem is that the number 6 million keeps popping up--in a recent column Leonard Pitts JR mentions 6 million "butchered", 6 million "obscenities." History should remember all the victims, those led to slaughter like lambs and those brave souls who resisted or spoke out.

Here's an interesting peice in the JP about a Jewish terrorist they arrested.



1992 Israeli Mossad tried to steal secret optical technology
1995 Israel aggressively collects [US] military and industrial technology.
1996 US technology has been acquired [by China] through Israel in the form of the Lavi fighter and possibly missile technology.
1997 David A. Tenenbaum, gives classified military information on missile systems and armored vehicles to Israeli officials
2001 Irv Rubin arrested for planning to bomb a US Congressman. He dies before he can be brought to trial
2004 Jane Harman caught by NSA trying to block prosecution of 2 spies by blackmailing Pelosi with AIPAC Funds


Babak, Larry Derfner is an American Israeli. He moved to Israel about 25 years ago. He didn't get fired for his column in the Jerusalem post, as R. Whitman suggests above, but for a short provocative article on a blog:

see his vita there:

Larry Derfner has clearly moved in this direction for quite some time now. He was a rather astonishing voice on the Jerusalem Post.

His Forward article linked below is interesting.


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