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09 September 2008

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Twit

Jonst,

I agree with you. Maybe then, god forbid, a McCain victory would actually be better for the country in the long term. This would surely represent rock bottom, making way for the **possibility** of change (i.e. a Democratic party humiliated into accepting actual change-makers like Mark Warner and Jim Webb into the mainstream).

My big fear with Obama is that he will do what Tony Blair did to Britain. Thatcher destroyed many central institutions of British life (unions, and that economically inefficient but socially cohesive British attitude, et al) for the sake of progress, just as Bush has destroyed our institutions for the sake of security. Obama will be faced with either the daunting task of fixing what Bush has broken, or 'rebranding' the destructive policies to make them palatable. Blair did the latter, and British society is permanently worse for it. I fear Obama will make a similar choice when confronted with the depths of our problems.

Anyway, I think this election is a big gamble either way.

John Moore

People have to remember that corporations are generally run as authoritarian organizations. Dissent is often frowned upon, if not crushed. The CEO is an autocrat, if not The Leader. Ask the Swiss bankers how good the Nazis were at conducting "business" with confiscated Jewish property and assets. Would we want a President to be "The Leader" - "der Furher" of the American Fatherland. This is why I never liked the name "Homeland" Security.

LarryM

It's amazing though, isn't it? I thought I was pretty cynical - certainly more cynical than 90% of my fellow citezens. Yet every day, my prior self seems gullible and naive.

What's happening now is this: prior to 2000, as toxic as things were, there were things that were simply beyond the pale, in terms of abuses of presidential power and campaigning. It's not that the worst of our politicians had any moral compunctions about certain abuses and campaign tactics, but they figured that they couldn't get away with them.

Then, the Bush administration, combined (in addition to it's other sins) abuses of executive power that make Nixon look like a choir boy with the worst kind of dirty, fear mongering politics. And .. they got away with it. Prospered, even.

McCain specifically, and his team generally, learned from this. And they are running the most disgusting , lie packed, campaign in my lifetime at least. I mean, look at the Willy Horton ad and the outrage it sparked. That concern seems almost quaint now; we see much worse from the sewer of the McCain campaign every day. At least that was fact based.

And now I'm going to go one step further than most people here. Ultimately, the fact that this stuff seems to WORK is an indictment of the American people. Ultimately the U.S. is goign to reap the whirlwind. And we will deserve it.

I fear that the only choice for the Dems now is to descend into the gutter with the Republicans. I don't like it, in the abstract, but the stakes are so high that there is no real choice.

William R. Cumming

Camille Paglia, a revisionist feminist, has posted an interesting article about Palin and feminism in Slate. If accurate, it might explain the 10 point switch in white women's possible November vote to McCain that has given such a lift to the Republicans. What is very very important now is to avoid posturing and as always the "devil is in the details." This is one of many reasons why the Republicans fail at governing. McCain is not Mr. Detail as a Senator but a broad strokes guy. Palin appears the same. I think Obama is the same while Biden is more detailed oriented but often misses the forest for the trees. Bottom line distress that the US system of Presidential selection has tossed up this menagiere. I still will vote for Obama and Biden but not hopeful as to their performance in office. Just cannot see voting for a person who was thrilled to fly jets. Or hunt Moose. By the way how many did she actually kill and have officially checked? Or was it like most Alaskans just to fill the freezer and to hell with reporting. I guess their is indignation and then as the Bible states "Rightous Indignation." Right now I am the latter about the election.

frank durkee

We are a capitalist country, and capitalism is about "winning", and doing what is necessary to "win".
One of the aids to winning is knowing how to break the rules and make that the "new" rule. Bush led the way not only in his campaigns but also in his public statements. spin , and at time out right lying. McCain's run is based on emotion and "semiotics", synbols, images without specific content His aim is to destroy Obama and elevate himself. It may be despicable but it so far is effective as Bush demonstrated in '04

jonst

Twit,

Your concerns have merit. I have the same concerns regards Obama/Blair. But it is still no gamble to me. McCain is showing, daily, he is a dangerous, arrogant, fool. I question his emotional stability. And I deeply distrust his wife, and the people around her. See how the family fortune was made.

So, no matter what my doubts, it is an easy call. But I am not optimistic anymore.

In any event...here is what I think is an excellent article on the Campaign. And it goes to the 'branding' aspect of this thread.

http://www.smirkingchimp.com/thread/17003

Clifford Kiracofe

Palin's wham is not ground moose burger.

It is "of the spirit." For some further data on Palin and her "spiritual" wham:

"Sarah Palin's churches are actively involved in a resurgent movement that was declared heretical by the Assemblies of God in 1949. This is the same 'Spiritual Warfare' movement that was featured in the award winning movie, "Jesus Camp," which showed young children being trained to do battle for the Lord. At least three of four of Palin's churches are involved with major organizations and leaders of this movement, which is referred to as The Third Wave of the Holy Spirit or the New Apostolic Reformation. The movement is training a young "Joel's Army" to take dominion over the United States and the world."....

" The Wasilla Assembly of God church is deeply involved with both Third Wave activities and theology. Their Master's Commission program is part of an three year post-high school international training program with studies in prophecy, intercessory prayer, Biblical exegesis, authority and leadership. The pastor, Ed Kalnins, and Masters Commission students have traveled to South Carolina to participate in a "prophetic conference" at Morningstar Ministries, one of the major ministries of the Third Wave movement. Becky Fischer was a pastor at Morningstar prior to being featured in the movie "Jesus Camp." The head of prophecy at Morningstar, Steve Thompson, is currently scheduled to do a prophecy seminar at the Wasilla Assembly of God. Other major leaders in the movement have also traveled to Wasilla to visit and speak at the church.

The Third Wave is a revival of the theology of the Latter Rain tent revivals of the 1950s and 1960s led by William Branham and others. It is based on the idea that in the end times there will be an outpouring of supernatural powers on a group of Christians that will take authority over the existing church and the world. The believing Christians of the world will be reorganized under the Fivefold Ministry and the church restructured under the authority of Prophets and Apostles and others anointed by God. The young generation will form "Joel's Army" to rise up and battle evil and retake the earth for God."

and so on,

http://www.informationclearinghouse.info/article20712.htm

On the Latter Rain Movement see Wiki:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Latter_Rain_Movement


Just wait until she is VP... one can imagine who will be surrounding Palin in the VP's office.

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