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18 December 2005

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Some Guy

This hypocritical delusion also enables the Bushites to declare any nation an enemy of freedom that does not meet their definition of the moment regarding Democracy. Just like POW's/enemy combatants. Its a democracy when they say it is, and if they think it is not, then its a problem.

I would add that the delusion seems quite hysterical. The painfully contorted defenses of illegal domestic spying strike me as a sign of reactionary hysteria. Bush could have gotten the warrants he wanted if the suspects were reasonably connected to terror groups. The assumption the FISA court needed bypassed is irrational, to say the least.

Sonoma

"..I think that a massively delusive disconnect from reality is the more likely explanation for their statements".

I couldn't disagree any more.

The Bushite pissants are fully aware that their actions fly in the face of reality. Rather, they comprehend the irrefutable, but believe their willpower alone can superimpose itself upon it.

There is more that a bit of a Superman mentality exposed in their every action, and their arrogance is exceeded only by their incompetence. They are are not merely reckless fools, but wicked in their recklessness.

And we have, thus far, proved a nation of fools by continuing to support them.

larry birnbaum

Pat,

I'm not sure that a certain amount of hypocrisy is incompatible with an effective or even a progressive US foreign policy. It might even be necessary in some instances. How much of a problem is the admin's hypocrisy vis a vis democratic governance in the Middle East? How much does it impact our ability to set reasonable objectives and achieve them?

This is not to support the admin's policies or the processes (if they can even be called that) by which they arrived at those policies. The historical ignorance you describe is astounding, and scary.

By the way I've found your web site to be incredibly informative and interesting!

Peter vE

The Bush administration's approach to democracy was clarified for me by their glee at the coup d'etat against Hugo Chavez in Venezuala.

By jumping in on the side of the plotters, they managed to, first: ensure that Chavez would be mad at them were he to regain power; second: demonstrate that they preferred a potentially servile autocrat to an independant democraticly elected leader; third: demonstrate that they couldn't determine winners from losers.

W. Patrick Lang

Larry,

Very interesting. I am looking to jump start discussion like yours.

Thanks.

Merry Christmas

Pat

W. Patrick Lang

Sonoma

I don't blame you. I am just being civil. It gets me in trouble. Something like opening doors for women who resent it. As Sergeant Warden said, it isn't about them.

Pat

Happy Jack

Incompetence, or deliberate? Hard to tell.

Bremer seemed clueless as to why Sistani wouldn't meet with him. You'd think someone would have researched past behavior of Shite clerics to occupation.

On the otherhand, if you believe in reverse-dominoes and democracy, you wouldn't want to undercut your argument. Lebanon's history would have provided an example for its neighbors to follow.

Egypt had some history with this. Of course, during this time they also saw the founding of the Muslim Brotherhood.

I think Iran had some experience in the 50's, but I don't recall what soured that experiment.

And don't forget Algeria's elections.

Patrick Henry

Pat..Im sorry for taking up so much space lately..but you seem to be tolerate of those of us who have nothing better to do on Rainy Days..

I just want to Add that I think President. Bush doesn't get it when it Comes to People Asking him the Hard Questions and Wanting to know Why..

Thats the American Way..Mr. President..Its Our Right..

Up to 60% of the People either dont Trust YOU..or Believe You..

Outside Your Party and Your Loyalists..you are not.well liked or Trusted....and Have Not Earned OUR Trust..

All That is based on your Actions..Attitude and policy..

We do not see you as Moses..coming down off the Mountains with the Tablets..and Captain AMERICA..Rolled into One..

There is nothing to indicate that you were Suddenly and Divinely Appointed by GOD to Save the World..or the United States..

TELLING us its so..just Doesn't cut it for the American People..


TRUST..Has to Be Earned Mr. President..

RESPECT..Has to Be Earned..

LEADERSHIP..Has to be demonstrated..

People automatically know it when they see it..

If you dont Trust your own party..The Constitutional Protections..and The lEGAL PROCESS.. orThe Congress and Its Represenatives of the People..or the People Themselfs..

or the FISA Court..for Due Process..Probable Cause Authority..to do what you are doing...

Then how can anyone TRUST YOU...???

BadTux

Ah yes, Iran's little experience in the 1950's. Do a little Google search for "iran mosaddeq" and you'll see what exactly happened to Iran's previous experience with democracy. Seems it got derailed by a US-backed army coup that then re-installed the Shah as absolute ruler. To be fair, Mosaddeq was hardly a democrat himself, given that he eventually assumed "emergency powers" and dissolved Parliament. On the other hand, the result of the coup was hardly what any "democracy-loving" person (or nation) would ever want -- a totalitarian dictatorship that grew increasingly harsh with time until it finally disintegrated and was replaced by a bunch of religious zealots.

- Badtux the History Penguin

W. Patrick Lang

Bad Tux,

first of all, I don't believe it. I mean about the bad tux. Back from exile?

I agree with all of that except that in the context of the Middle East I don't think the Shah was all that bad.

I mean, look at the rest of them. pl

BadTux

I agree that realpolitik says that the Shah wasn't so bad, considering the alternatives (a Communist-dominated democracy that hates America in the context of the Mossadeq regime, or an Islamist democracy that hates America, if we use Iraq as an example). I was just pointing out that, if you're purporting to be a lover of democracy and freedom, removing one guy on his way to being a dictator in order to install another dictator isn't exactly goin' in a positive direction.

As for the "back from exile" bit, nope, couldn't get back to Louisiana. I was hoping to be back by Christmas, but things are seriously FUBAR there, and nobody outside Louisiana seems to give a **** that a major American city and 2/3rds of the Louisiana economy have basically been written off by the national government. I mentioned the other day that they were still finding bodies in the ruins, and co-workers were shocked, "I thought they'd already cleaned all that up? Aren't they doing any reconstruction yet?" I had to gently break it to them that the only "reconstruction" going on was to Halliburton's pocketbook -- the stench, the piles of rotting garbage, the body-strewn rubble, it's all just sitting there, with nobody doing anything about it because the city is bankrupt, the state is bankrupt, and the federal government doesn't give a ****.

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